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Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by SICK, Mar 15, 2014.
Just Alvarez. The rest of them are trash.
Then why sign them in the first place? Back when the ballpark opened, we wanted a sign that things had changed. We didn't get that.
This Stanton contract might be the sign.
Im pretty sure if things are so bad we need to trade him, he will waive it.
They extracted short term value from for relatively cheap and then received a number of (in my minority opinion, crappy) prospects; one of them which turned into a young, very good SP in Hederson Alvarez.
If it was done by someone other than Loria, it would be considered absolutely genius. If you remember, I never had a problem trading those guys. My only problem was with the very ****ty return.
King Lou knows all.
The Marlins haul for Reyes et al was what it was to entice Toronto to pick up the salary.
You weren't getting Travis D'Arnaud without picking up the money.
It should have but the FO were demanding Marisnick, Hech, and Nicolino instead. All garbage.
That just means Stanton can choose who he gets traded to, it doesn't mean he can't get traded.
Wasn't garbage. They dumped injury prone Reyes, damaged goods Johnson and decent but not great Buehrle, all with high salaries for a bunch of young players. Reyes missed half the 2013 season, Johnson is garbage now and not even a Blue Jay anymore and Buehrle was just ok. Not to mentioned they dumped that trash John Buck too.
They got Alvarez who has been great, Marisnick who they turned into Cosart who has a lot of promise, Hechavarria who is serviceable enough, and still have DeSclafani and Nicolino in the minors who might turn out to be decent arms.
Only real losses were $8m and Bonifacio.
They basically gave the Blue Jays a bag of sh#t, lighted and all, and got nice stuff in return.
Nobody liked the trade at the time, but in hindsight you have to admit it was a good trade and the right move.
Marisnick helped land Cosart, and I certainly wouldn't say Hech is "garbage". He's not Derek Jeter but he's a good young SS who still has room for improvement. Nicolino I don't even have any comment on.
In 2014, Marlins got out of Hech only slightly less production than Blue Jays got out of Reyes, just for perspective.
This. I know for some reason Hech is the Marlins fans' punching bag, but I don't really see why. He's a solid player. It wasn't Marisnick alone, but he was a big piece in the Cosart deal and it's early, and I know people will cite metrics to show his success might not be sustainable, but until he proves otherwise, he was a good pickup. The jury is still out on Nicolino and Desclafani.
I said all of that about Reyes, Buerhle, and JJ above, so.
Alvarez is definitely good.
Marisnick is whatever, boom-or-bust type but a fine prospect. He did turn into Cosart, but I absolutely question whether Cosart has a lot of promise. In fact, I'd say he has little upside. His peripherals aren't great, and he pitched over his head last year. He's a solid #3-#4 starter that's under club control for a while. Nice to have around but nothing special.
Hechavarria is only borderline acceptable because he's making the minimum. He's not a longterm starter that this FO thinks.
DeSclafani is a low end/nothing prospect. Potential #4/5, most likely long reliever, spot starter, or maybe back end of the bullpen type. There's nothing special about him.
Nicolino is garbage.
As I said at the time, there were good baseball reasons at the time to make that trade, but the return was awful. Quantity over quality.
Hech is a far below average player with very little upside. Not sure why everyone is turning him into something he's not.
Not me, I said he was serviceable enough, nothing more. I doubt he'll be able to even reproduce this season increased offensive output, for him, next season.
My thing with the trade was that Marlins were able to get pieces back, even some nice pieces, from a load of sh#t. You say the return was awful, but look at what the Marlins gave the Jays. $145M in salary obligations for above average, damaged and **** players.
Jose Reyes alone will be making $22M for the next 4 season. Buerhle made $18M in 14 and will be making the same next season.
They might not have gotten a great haul back, but they sent toxic crap and plain old sh#t over to the poor Jays and got at least Alvarez in return and some young players back.
Anyway, ESPN reporting Marlins going after Adam LaRoche for 1st base.
I think anyone who made Loria's statements before the opening of a ballpark, and then pulled the plug halfway through the season, would have been lambasted as Loria was.
LaRoche and Shields would be nice gets. They would round out the roster pretty nicely.
That's fair. I still believe the return should have been better but we'll just keep going in circles and neither of us can prove anything.
I'm not sure Adam LaRoche would be a big upgrade. He'll be 35 next season and I'm not sure he can repeat last year. Wonder what the money looks like.
I'd rather have LaRoche than Garrett Jones as an everyday starter.
Garrett Jones should have been platooned with Jeff Baker but this FO is incompetent.
Agreed. I don't think I can handle watching Jones waste at bats next year. The 1-2 black hole that was Salty and Jones was unbearable. Ultimately they need to either add 1b or 2b in my opinion. I think they can get away with not upgrading one of them, but not both. Also it would be great to get a better power hitter behind Stanton.
Really need to upgrade all of the infield spots.
ESPN also reporting Marlins in talks with James Shields.
Meanwhile, Pablo Sandoval reportedly has offers from both Giants and Red Socks for 5 years $80-$90M. Wonder if the Marlins will jump on that, thinking maybe to move McGehee to 1st base.
I also wonder if these reports are pointing towards the Marlins maybe going towards the strategy of securing serviceable 1st baseman like LaRoche for a couple of years, getting a marquee pitcher like Shields or Lester, and then using Andrew Heaney and some other of their minor league arms to go at the Cubs who are stacked in infield prospects and making a trade for Starlin Castro. Move Hech to 2nd base.
Agreed, just can't do it all this year.
If we are going to trade young pitching, I don't think Castro is who I want in return.
And he's generally a black hole in the lineup until around June.
Highly doubt it happens but would be great...
Future rotation of
Today's Miami Herald
Per Rotoworld marlins have offered contract to LaRoche.
2/20 is a pretty decent deal for LaRoche IMO. I wouldn't call it a bargain necessarily, but it's certainly not breaking the bank. If they add a decent pitcher and figure out 2B I would feel pretty good about this team next year and beyond.
So do we release Jones at that point?
Supposedly they're trying to trade him.
They need a better Local TV deal.....even with attendance down, they always hit big TV numbers.
Not always. It's been abysmal over the last 6-7 years
For anything. If you release him, you still have to pay his salary
This. A PTBNL or low level minor leaguer is probably what they'd get back. You're essentially trading him for nothing just to get rid of his contract.