****The Official 2016-2017 NBA Thread****

"Stringer Bell wrote:

LeBron is not taking any pay cuts. One of the big reasons he left Miami.

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Not buying it. That Sports Illustrated article wasn't titled "I'm coming home to get paid".

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"finfansince72 wrote:

Oh yea and Lebron was the best player in the series and dominated long stretches in the series to win games for his team. I wouldn't call a couple of all time great games in the NBA Finals by Lebron and Kyrie anything lucky, they were both dominant for good stretches. GS didn't play well and Cleveland did, it wasn't a lucky victory, Cleveland outplayed GS. Your, it was lucky take is ridiculous. Who cares who was favored, what does that have to do with anything?

Historically, who was favored has everything to do with it. In the NBA huge underdogs rarely win series. This is just a fact. And Kyrie having all-time great games when he hasn't done so in the past is an anomaly. Unless Kyrie and their other players continue to have games like that and GSW's players continue to play as badly then the anomaly has to be considered luck. Reality is that most of those performances are unlikely to be repeated. I know you want to continue the fantasy that anything against Cleveland must be bias, but unbiased analysis looks at how teams and players have played to evaluate how they're likely to play in any given series.

"rafael wrote:

Historically, who was favored has everything to do with it. In the NBA huge underdogs rarely win series. This is just a fact. And Kyrie having all-time great games when he hasn't done so in the past is an anomaly. Unless Kyrie and their other players continue to have games like that and GSW's players continue to play as badly then the anomaly has to be considered luck. Reality is that most of those performances are unlikely to be repeated. I know you want to continue the fantasy that anything against Cleveland must be bias, but unbiased analysis looks at how teams and players have played to evaluate how they're likely to play in any given series.

Why do I have a feeling if Oklahoma City would've found a way to beat Golden State you wouldn't of called that series look by any stretch of imagination.

You're mad because you're forced to eat crow after all the silly comment you made we get it just let it go

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"rafael wrote:

Historically, who was favored has everything to do with it. In the NBA huge underdogs rarely win series. This is just a fact. And Kyrie having all-time great games when he hasn't done so in the past is an anomaly. Unless Kyrie and their other players continue to have games like that and GSW's players continue to play as badly then the anomaly has to be considered luck. Reality is that most of those performances are unlikely to be repeated. I know you want to continue the fantasy that anything against Cleveland must be bias, but unbiased analysis looks at how teams and players have played to evaluate how they're likely to play in any given series.

Its bias when you keep making things up to justify an obviously biased opinion. Cleveland played great, thats not luck. They also played good defense and has a lot to do with GS not playing well. Historically teams that live by jumpshots die by jumpshots at some point. Also GS played like this in the last NBA Finals against the Cavs but the Cavs team was depleted so they still won. When a team outplays another team its not luck, Lebron played like an NBA Finals MVP and he got help from an All Star Caliber player in Irving that isn't luck thats two All Stars showing up and playing like it.

"Fin-O wrote:

Why do I have a feeling if Oklahoma City would've found a way to beat Golden State you wouldn't of called that series look by any stretch of imagination.

You're mad because you're forced to eat crow after all the silly comment you made we get it just let it go

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The odds in that series were much closer. This is not anger, it's just logic. Vegas set the odds, I didn't.

"finfansince72 wrote:

Its bias when you keep making things up to justify an obviously biased opinion. Cleveland played great, thats not luck. They also played good defense and has a lot to do with GS not playing well. Historically teams that live by jumpshots die by jumpshots at some point. Also GS played like this in the last NBA Finals against the Cavs but the Cavs team was depleted so they still won. When a team outplays another team its not luck, Lebron played like an NBA Finals MVP and he got help from an All Star Caliber player in Irving that isn't luck thats two All Stars showing up and playing like it.

I didn't make anything up. Irving did not show up like he has in the past. He played way above that level. That's an anomaly. You keep acting like this was some expected outcome that I'm just denying. Reality is that every expert and Vegas had the Cavs as a huge underdog. One of the largest in recent history. They weren't all biased either. Using objective analysis the Cavs were an inferior team. That was the narrative. All teams need some luck to win a championship. When you're a huge underdog you need a ton of luck. The Cavs got that. There's no need to change the narrative after the fact.

Am I the only not buying any story about Wade leaving Miami? Seems like a bunch of BS.

At this point, if he wants to leave, just leave.

Go to Cleveland for $5 million and don't win a championship.

Then come back to and tell me it was worth it

LeBron James is this team's ghost. He haunts us. He is frickin poison. A tumor still infecting us. There was no problem until Wade spent a week on a boat with this clown. Now he's going to take the mid level in Cleveland while LeBron makes $30 million. Funny he seems perfectly willing to sacrifice for this jerk off and then thanks him for it

I'm guessing this is still a power play from Wade. No one took his threats to Milwaukee or Denver serious. Miami leaked the 2/$40mil offer. He decided to threaten in a way that would hurt the worst.

"dolfan32323 wrote:

Am I the only not buying any story about Wade leaving Miami? Seems like a bunch of BS.

I'm not buying it. And I'm not going to react to every alleged rumor out there.

"rafael wrote:

The odds in that series were much closer. This is not anger, it's just logic. Vegas set the odds, I didn't.

There is much more that goes into odds making than who the better team is.

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Riley would never do it but if i were him id pull the offer off the table. Enough is enough, tired of this diva.

"Fin-O wrote:

There is much more that goes into odds making than who the better team is.

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Right, but regardless the fact is that these two teams were considered a much closer match-up.

I can understand people not being happy with Wade playing hardball but a little class here guys. He is the best thing that ever happened to the Heat.

Dirk signs 2 year 40 million deal with mavericks.

"dolfan32323 wrote:

Am I the only not buying any story about Wade leaving Miami? Seems like a bunch of BS.

I'm with you. I was with you 100% but then when I saw that tweet from the private jet company saying that Wade is on a plane with Dan Gilbert and Lebron James, that became more like 98%.

OK so I had seen someone on twitter write something about how Wade physically couldn't have been on that plane because of where he was prior to that. And someone in the know just reiterated that to me.

But there are reports that Wade is in "preliminary" talks about rejoining LeBron with the Cavs. And I'm sure that reach-out has occurred because A) LeBron and Dwyane are friends so whatever Dwyane needs as a favor I think LeBron is more than happy to oblige, and B) The team that LeBron just beat in the finals just pulled in Kevin effing Durant so year I think a nuclear arms race may be a valid first instinct.

But I think this is just a dance, Wade trying to remind Riley (and the world, especially for the purposes of marketing) that he's still a highly coveted player.

Yeah great reminder, the Nuggets and the Bucks want you at max, the Cavs want you at MLE.. No one else wants him

"Vertical Limit wrote:

Yeah great reminder, the Nuggets and the Bucks want you at max, the Cavs want you at MLE.. No one else wants him

I sense sarcasm but yes that is an effective reminder that multiple teams still view him as a max player and that the Cavs and LeBron James view him as the nuclear arms race answer to Golden State's signing Kevin Durant. Yes that's all very flattering for Wade's image and should have real ($$$) effects on his marketing power.

Why does Wade need to remind Riley? Is he not wanted by the Heat? Has he not been offered $20m per year for the last year and the next two? The Heat have shown Wade he is beyond wanted, they've just asked him to work with them to preserve flexibility for free agency to help the team, and yes, to help Wade too.

This narrative of Wade as the selfless sacrificer and victim to the backstabbing and ungrateful Heat is becoming tiresome and annoying.

"ckparrothead wrote:

I'm with you. I was with you 100% but then when I saw that tweet from the private jet company saying that Wade is on a plane with Dan Gilbert and Lebron James, that became more like 98%.

That account wasn't even verified.

"Sumlit wrote:

Why does Wade need to remind Riley? Is he not wanted by the Heat? Has he not been offered $20m per year for the last year and the next two? The Heat have shown Wade he is beyond wanted, they've just asked him to work with them to preserve flexibility for free agency to help the team, and yes, to help Wade too.

This narrative of Wade as the selfless sacrificer and victim to the backstabbing and ungrateful Heat is becoming tiresome and annoying.

This is just me from the outside, so I don't know all the details. But it sort of feels like Wade is always the guy asked to sacrifice. And he's sort of put on the backburner while they chase bigger fish.

Like - they maxed out Whiteside and then chased Durant. What was going to be left for Wade at that point? Think he didn't notice that?

Again - I'm not as deep into the details as you guys. But it seems like if you were Dwyane Wade - had won one in 2006, orchestrated the moves that brough 2 more while taking less money, a smaller role - and now you're being put on the back burner and being told you'll get paid next year every off season. Yeah, I could see him being annoyed.

I had some HILARIOUS "Warriors are going to be too thin!" and "Dray and KD can't handle an entire season worth of beating at the 4/5!" takes before they signed Zaza.

Next season is going to be insaaaaaaaaaaane with them having to re-sign Durant, Steph, and Iggy.

"PhiNomina wrote:

This is just me from the outside, so I don't know all the details. But it sort of feels like Wade is always the guy asked to sacrifice. And he's sort of put on the backburner while they chase bigger fish.

Like - they maxed out Whiteside and then chased Durant. What was going to be left for Wade at that point? Think he didn't notice that?

Again - I'm not as deep into the details as you guys. But it seems like if you were Dwyane Wade - had won one in 2006, orchestrated the moves that brough 2 more while taking less money, a smaller role - and now you're being put on the back burner and being told you'll get paid next year every off season. Yeah, I could see him being annoyed.

Sacrifice what though? Giving up a max salary for a better team is not a sacrifice, it's a compromise. Giving up a max salary for slightly less, and playing with your friends, having overwhelming success translate into increased legacy, endorsements and rewards is hardly a sacrifice at all.

Wade is not put on the back-burner at all. He is the face of the franchise, the Heat just count on him to help them with the flexibility needed to keep improving the team for his sake too. That's what it takes to be competitive every year and not go into rebuilds.

And btw, all this talk about his monetary sacrifice, Wade has made upwards of $150m in career salary and likely ends up with $200m earnings in salary as an exclusive Heat player if he chooses. Let's not act like Wade has been cheated here. All that has been asked of him as the face of the franchise is to help out with flexibility to keep the team competitive.

I think the real problem here is people in his ear filling his head with crap. I suspect he has quite a few of these people around him lately and therein lie all the recent issues.

It's day 5 of free agency, it's hardly been a week, the offer came to him on the morning of day 4. Riley's job is to win, not to stroke Wade's ****.

Wade needs to stop acting like a diva and just sign or leave. Period.

And you're right Sumlit, many franchise players do it. Brady turns 39 next month, and for the last decade all I've ever heard every offseason is him restructuring his contract to provide more space for the Patriots to remain competitive. And at 39 his goal has not changed.

Wade seems like he just wants to get paid no matter what, he's done winning.

Lebatard just said the following:

LeBatard: there's the risk that Denver or Milwaukee has a prearranged deal with Cleveland to sign Wade and trade him to Cleveland after December 15th