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The Official, Lets be optimistic about Matt Moore thread.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by DolPhinPhan7, Dec 12, 2016.

  1. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Because your main implication is that you dont believe the dropoff between the two is that significant. Even if those arent 'your words' that is your implication, and its wrong, provably, even if Moore gets help and plays fantastic down the stretch. Tannehill is (now) significantly better than moore in almost every category that classifies a QB. and doughty isnt even on the same planet as either of them.
     
  2. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    How am I wrong? He saw the guy open (that is critical), threw it the only place he could (as in receiver, not location) Stills adjusted and made a great play, pretty much sealed the game with the play. and I know you want to twist it that I am wrong someway somehow, but even you admit Moore saw the route open and threw the ball. It was short because it was all arm, as he got drilled while throwing it.

    I am not the guy trying to make it about anything, not sure what you are trying to twist yet again, I said great play, great read, great adjustment.
     
  3. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    LOL so if Moore plays great down the stretch it has nothing to do with him, but if Tannehill plays great it is all Tannehill.... you are funny.
     
  4. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Nobody would've had a problem with you if that was the reason and you know it. You are so disingenuous it's frightening. You know why you are propping up Moore, we all do. You can't even admit it to yourself . Carry on. My day is complete. Dolphins won, Denver lost and OUR QB is gonna be ok. All is right with the world


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  5. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    I am propping up Moore because I do not believe the season is over like some do. You are angry for some bizarre reason that I might actually be right.
     
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  6. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Which one is the career backup who wasnt picked up by QB starved teams over multiple FAs? Tannehill has outplayed Moore SIGNIFICANTLY enough to earn that benefit of the doubt. What player coach or team on the planet picks Moore over Tannehill for anything? NO one.


    So actually yes. Moore has been in the league long enough to where even if he plays amazing down the stretch we still know what we have in him. which is less than Tannehill has to offer. if Moore wins us a superbowl, Tannehill is still starting next season.
     
  7. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Once again, where did I say the season was over because of Moore? Where? You jump from thing to thing making no sense. Dude, if I was the only one busting your chops a bit, I would back off. That not the case .. clearly... but you don't see it. Everybody seems to have the same reaction to you(except one).. why is that? Must be me I guess. Anyway, gonna enjoy this run . Go Phins


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  8. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    ??? he was 6-3 TD/INT, with 2 of those games having 98 or higher rating, going 2-1.
     
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  9. Dolphins Dad

    Dolphins Dad Member

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    True, but he had 5 turnovers in the 3 games. He is careless with the ball. It's a concern.
     
  10. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's a very ignorant statement. Moore has a better career record than Tannehill. Moore has a better career QBR than Tannehill. Moore has been teaching Tannehill how to be a leader for five years now; that's the only reason you keep an aging veteran on the roster. And just because Tannehill has played better in recent weeks than you remember Moore playing, that doesn't mean a darn thing.

    Tannehill may be slightly better than Moore in a few areas, but Moore is world's better handling/avoiding pressure and seeing the field. And with our receivers who tend to get open deep an awful lot, some would argue that Moore has been a better fit for this offense all along. We'll definitely find out over the next 3 weeks though.
     
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  11. DolPhinPhan7

    DolPhinPhan7 Well-Known Member

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    And that's not a concern with Tannehill? RT hasn't been great keeping the turnovers down throughout his career. He was during the 6-game winning stream but against Baltimore and even against Arizona, he started giving the ball up again.

    I'm not saying that Moore is better than RT. But last we saw Moore, he was finishing the 2011 season 6-3. They almost beat the Cowboys on Thanksgiving that year. They should have also beaten the Tebow Broncos that year.

    They could do a lot worse than Moore. That's why they've kept him as the backup through the RT years. I think with a week playing with the first team, he'll be up to speed. He has the weapons and unlike Sunday, it shouldn't be raining (may be snowing though :-/)
     
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  12. P h i N s A N i T y

    P h i N s A N i T y My Porpoise in Life

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    On a bad team he and Reggie carried to a respectable finish. I feel you underestimate Moore and especially Gase as apposed to what we've had.
     
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  13. Finster

    Finster Finsterious Finologist

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    Well, RT has thrown 4 INTs and fumbled 4 times, losing 1, in the last 2 games, so that's 5 TOs in just the last 2 games.

    RT has 12 INTs and 9 fumbles on the year, 4 of the INTs and 4 of the fumbles come in the 2 most important games of the year, I'm kind of hoping the TOs go down a bit.
     
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  14. Dolphins Dad

    Dolphins Dad Member

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    I hope you are right!
     
  15. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    In my opinion, you're wrong because he didn't throw the ball to that spot... where only Stills could catch it as you're saying. IMO, and the replay really doesn't lie either IMO... The ball was under thrown, to that spot, because he was hit. It wasn't thrown there on purpose as you're suggesting.

    I'm not twisting anything, that's all you man. You're trying to say he purposely put that ball in that spot, I'm saying to you he didn't. Not because I'm trying to twist this into anything, but because, it sure as hell looks like that's exactly what happened. Stills is still running as far as I can tell (albeit without the all-22 views) well after the throw, it's only after he sees its a wobbler that he comes back to it. That ball ended up where it was because of the hit, not because Matt Moore made some crazy throw to that exact spot in the hope that him and Stills were on the same page. It happened that way because of the hit to Moore IMO. Did he make the read and see the open man to throw to, yes. Nobody is disputing that. I've never once said he made the wrong decision.

    These were your words earlier when I was explaining my point of view on the play to you:

    "Not sure what your agenda is in saying it was not a great play by Moore. If he does not throw it or takes sack, game likely goes into OT.
    You continue to want to stir things up all the while saying you aren't.. It is comical really."

    There is no agenda. I've never said it wasn't a great play, and I'm not going to say it's a great play either. The result is great. Absolutely. But, unless Moore and Stills both come out and say "Yeah, Matt told me in the huddle he was going to throw it short, and I said I'd come back to it." Then I'll say great play. However, if you watch it, the result, wasn't the intent. It's that simple to me from what I see. That's not twisting anything to fit anything you want to try and accuse me of doing. It's my assessment of the play. The result was great, if anything the success of that play is more on Kenny Stills. Hell, if that's Devante Parker on that play he's probably still running to the endzone and that ball falls incomplete on the spot.

    You want to sit here and act like it was amazing, and to say look! Game winning drive! Comeback win! Matt Moore is clutch!! All things of which you've said... Bro, everyone see's through what you're trying to do with that stuff. That's your passive aggressive way of taking shots at Tannehill. I'm sorry that you can't handle an objective assessment of the play without thinking it's got an agenda attached and thinking I'm trying to discredit Matt Moore, I'm not. I've clearly criticized Ryan. I've supported Ryan when justified as well. I've never said anything bad about Matt Moore aside from not having full confidence in him, but that has ZERO to do with what I think of the play. I've said the ball was underthrown by the looks of things, and attributed that to the hit he's taking as he's throwing. I mean I can't be any more objective about it than that. So, don't give me crap about stirring anything up, when that's clearly not what I'm doing, but it's a whole lot closer to what you're doing; as usual.

    I'm not sure what more you really want me to say about it? You want to say it's a great play by Moore, just because he made the read, and I'm suggesting to you that it's not for all of the reasons above. I'll let the other guys here sort out the difference between that assessment and judgement between if that was a Tannehill pass or a Moore pass. I'm not at all interested in that.

    We can just agree to disagree and move on, it's just not worth more than that at this point.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2016
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  16. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yep, Matt Moore will be a huge improvement.. silly Gase playing Tannehill over Moore.. what a dope!. Great news about Tannehill today huh Finster?


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  17. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well said again Brandon. Been trying all day to tell 25 what you just wrote. Maybe your well written post will hit home.... not really counting on it


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  18. keypusher

    keypusher Well-Known Member

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    Moore basically hasn't played in five years, which is an eternity in the NFL. Last time he saw significant action, though, he was decent.

    Tannehill right now is the 15th-rated pssser in the NFL. As Dolphins fans, we better hope the drop-off to Moore isn't too steep.
     
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  19. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Rooting like hell for Moore to do well, I am pretty confident in him. Some of the comments today are pretty laughable comparing Moore to Ryan.. silly. But I have a feeling Matt will do a good job


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  20. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    again try to answer the question..... why are you upset that I am pleased the Dolphins won and Moore played well? I am not upset that you are pleased the Dolphins won.

    Why were you not upset when I said I thought the Dolphins would be ok when Pouncey got hurt?

    Why were you not upset when I said the defense might actually be better (because of his free lancing) when Jones got hurt? And it could be argued they are playing better if not equal as Rambo has filled in nicely.

    lets keep this one simple cause you can't follow a conversation well.
     
  21. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    Where did I say SPOT anywhere in my post? Keep on twisting Brandon.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2016
  22. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Sadly it was answered numerous times, most eloquently by Brandon. No need to say more.Nobody was upset that you were glad and Moore played well.. nobody. People see through you and what you write.. it's childish. Read Brandon's reply to you.. the answers are all in there. I'm sure you read it and dismissed it all. Sadly, you accuse others of not following a conversation, yet you
    Learn nothing from informative answers to your questions. The real answer lies in that most will root for Moore because he is our QB. We all know why you will be rooting for him and propping up his play.. and it's not for the same reason. Pretty simple to understand, except for you.


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  23. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    [QUOTE="

    You want to sit here and act like it was amazing, and to say look! Game winning drive! Comeback win! Matt Moore is clutch!! All things of which you've said... Bro, everyone see's through what you're trying to do with that stuff. That's your passive aggressive way of taking shots at Tannehill. I'm sorry that you can't handle an objective assessment of the play without thinking it's got an agenda attached and thinking I'm trying to discredit Matt Moore, I'm not. I've clearly criticized Ryan. I've supported Ryan when justified as well. I've never said anything bad about Matt Moore aside from not having full confidence in him, but that has ZERO to do with what I think of the play. I've said the ball was underthrown by the looks of things, and attributed that to the hit he's taking as he's throwing. I mean I can't be any more objective about it than that. So, don't give me crap about stirring anything up, when that's clearly not what I'm doing, but it's a whole lot closer to what you're doing; as usual.

    I'm not sure what more you really want me to say about it? You want to say it's a great play by Moore, just because he made the read, and I'm suggesting to you that it's not for all of the reasons above. I'll let the other guys here sort out the difference between that assessment and judgement between if that was a Tannehill pass or a Moore pass. I'm not at all interested in that.

    We can just agree to disagree and move on, it's just not worth more than that at this point.[/QUOTE]

    Again the is your twisting of things and I am sorry your feelings are hurt. Was it not a game winning drive???? How are you going to twist that one? Again if TAnnehill had made the play and the read people would be saying it was great. So why is it wrong for me to say it was a great play by Moore?

    I never once said the ball was not underthrown. I did say it was a great read and a great throw, and he AND Stills made a great play, but you go on twisting things cause some how your feelings are hurt cause I thought someone else besides Tannehill made a great play.

    Go look at my posts where I have given Tannehill credit for making plays; also go look where I have said he has progressed.... instead of just trying to twist things in your own mind.
     
  24. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    again how is it ok for you to say he will do a good job, but others cannot make that same statement?
     
  25. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Because, and for the last time, your opinion is based on your bias and agenda toward Tannehill. Mine are for OUR HOPE THAT MOORE PLAYS WELL FOR THE GOOD OF THE TEAM!!!You know it and so does everyone else. Sorry 25, your history posting on this subject is clear. Live with what you have written. You made your reputation, live with it


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  26. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    do you root for tannehill and prop up his play? You are bizzare

    again try to answer the question, why were you not upset when I said Dolphins would be ok without Pouncey and Jones?????

    are you dense enough to think I don't root for Tannehill despite spending close to 300 dollars a year on NFL ticket to watch the Dolphins games and have for like 20 years?

    laughable......
     
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  27. dolphin25

    dolphin25 Well-Known Member

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    you are a sad person..... yeah I want Moore to play well....... gosh that is so bizarre you even make that statement.

    hilarious
     
  28. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You attack his play at every chance. We win 6 games and your compliments are rare and lukewarm at best. They lose a tough game on the road and play poorly. Both Tannehill and the entire team. You take the chance after that loss to take shots at him again. Tannehill throws 3 td vs Arizona and Moore comes in late and moves the ball into FG range for the win. Great job by Moore. And the next morning ,after a possible horrible injury to our QB, you take the opportunity to push Moore big time. I am not even close to being the only one who saw through it. ..not even close to being the only one. I don't have to prop up RT's play, I just cheer for him and hope good things happen. Pouncey and Jones? Nobody saw that opinion as a bias because??? You didn't spend the last two yrs writing post after post downplaying and minimizing every thing Pouncey or Jones did. You know, passes hitting receivers in the hands and you blaming the pass. RT putting up good numbers and calling it all garbage time. Dolphins finally winning games and you complaining about modest stats....Starting to become clearer
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2016
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  29. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Not sad at all my friend. My team is in the playoff hunt. Our Qb is going to be ok. Looks like he has CEMENTED Being the guy for the foreseeable future. We have a promising HC...sad? Hell no.
     
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  30. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Maybe you didn't say it, but that's the impression it gives off by you saying it's a great play by Moore, that it was done just that way on purpose. Hell, maybe it was, but it just seems more likely to me that it was because of the hit, and a great adjustment by Stills. We could both be right, we could both be wrong, in the end, Matt Moore came in, plays got made where they needed to by QB, and WR, and Kicker, and we won the damn game. lol How it happened, we can agree to disagree on and that's all good. Just please, don't think my opinion on the play is based on anything related to a Tannehill/Moore debate, because it's not about that at all for me, I just don't care and I've been saying that. It may be the case for some, but I have no interest in going there.

    It's all good man.
     
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  31. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Lets talk about ignorant statements, lol. First of all I never devalued Moores importance to the team or to Tannehill. I simply stated he is not better than Tannehill and it's not even exactly close. His leg up USED to be the deepball but That is no longer the case. There is a pretty considerable dropoff between the two. No one in their right mind in the NFL picks Moore over Tannehill for any situation. . . Also Why would you use win/loss to compare them which isn't even remotely a QB stat? How about looking at actual stats? Tannehills QBR is 86.5 to Moores 79.4 per nfl so youre wrong there. Tannehill is 106:66 TD int to Moores almost 1:1 ratio of 33:28. Not close. completion Tannehill 62.7 to Moores 58.9. yards per game 239.7 to 128.6. Look up any actual QB stat even while taking into account the sample sizes and Tannehill is still better. including the deep ball. Hopefully Gase can work his magic and make a good gameplan for Matt but the guy is a career back up for a reason.

    And IMO Moores magical and unquantifiable 'sense for pressure' you speak of does not make up for his other issues.

    Again. I like the guy. Amazing teammate by all accounts. Im rooting for him, but at the end of the day Moore can play hall of fame worthy down this stretch and help bring a superbowl home, But Tannehill will still be starting over him next year. That's an easy guarantee.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2016
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  32. keypusher

    keypusher Well-Known Member

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    Partly because that was Moore's only really significant play, and it had such a role in the final outcome, we are probably overanalyzing it. But I'll join in.

    It was 1st and 10 on the 30, 43 seconds remaining, Miami had one time out. Cardinals blitz. Branden Albert turns out to help on the outside and a blitzer runs through completely untouched. Was that Albert's fault? Moore's? The play design? Anyone know? We easily could have lost our backup quarterback there.

    Anyway, you're Matt Moore, here comes a linebacker at full speed, you have a man open deep, what do you do? Make up your mind quick! Well, we all know what he did, and the result. He can't take the sack, because then we are out of FG range. Maybe he should throw it away, because it's first down? On the other hand, if you hit the pass, you've all but won the game. He's obviously risking an interception, but with only one Cardinal and one Dolphin there, I think it's an acceptable risk. We definitely needed to move the ball closer to the end zone, because I don't like Andrew Franks' chances from 47 yards on that field in those conditions.

    The throw doesn't bother me. Moore had a decent arm five years ago, and I sure hope he still does. But he couldn't show it on that play, because of the blitz. He got it there, more or less, and Stills did the rest.

    The play doesn't really say a lot about Moore as a passer. It does say he's still a risktaker. Is that good or bad? We're about to find out.
     
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  33. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Him being a risktaker has been a big contributer to his career 1:1 TD:INTs
     
  34. Rock Sexton

    Rock Sexton Anti-Homer

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    You sound very begrudging in your analysis of that last drive.

    I mean for f- sakes the guy hasn't started a game in 5 years. He's thrust into action in the 2nd half during terrible weather and all momentum being pissed away. I can almost guarantee you thought we were going to lose (hell even I did).

    Hit or not hit - we have prior history to know Moore is capable of connecting on deep balls. What is the point of even debating that?
     
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  35. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Personally, I hope for the best with Moore, but have little confidence in him not turning the ball over. In 12 games in 2011, he had 9 INTs and 14 fumbles. I also remember him throwing a 100 yard Pick 6 to Revis. People forget that in 2011 we had the #6 scoring defense and Carpenter was hitting almost 90% of his kicks that season.

    I like Moore's moxie and he's a great guy and team mate, but I don't see him as a season savior. He made 2 passes that Stills bailed him out on. The 12 yard pick up was behind Stills for the first down and 29 yarder hung up in the air giving Stills time to come back and adjust to it being under thrown while being interfered with. Great play by Stills. As for Moore, not bad for a guy who hadn't thrown a meaningful pass in 5 years.

    All said, I have faith in Gase and hope that we can go out and win the next 2 with Moore at the helm.
     
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  36. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'll start a new thread on Moore where people can see the math and better understand how he got screwed from the start. His stats are worse than Tannehill due to one year where he played the season with concussions and almost ended his own life. Outside of that instance though, he's been a low 90's quarterback with enormous upside.
     
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  37. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Irrelevant. Tannehill is better across the board, if I take away tannehills worst season its even worse for Moore. and let's not pretend he didn't also have his own issues that have 'screwed him from the start'. Are you really going to try and make a case about Moore being better? good luck. He's been a career back up for a reason. if anyone believed in this tremendous 'upside' he wouldnt have been passed up in multiple FAs. Nitpick circumstantials all day if you want, but the numbers don't lie. great backup to have and a good guy but not better than Tannehill.
     
  38. KeyFin

    KeyFin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Tannehill didn't play with a head injury during his worst season and really, the first three years of his career. Big difference there. You're entitled to your opinions though and I respect them...just like you should respect mine.
     
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  39. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    He's a good guy and a good back up. that is my opinion that most people share. He is not a better QB than Tannehill. That's a provable fact.
     
  40. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Was it Bum Phillips who said that the backup QB is always the most popular guy on the team?

    I'm wondering how is it that 4 coaching staffs had no idea how great a resource Matt Moore is (Field General, et al...) and what they were passing up the past 9 years.
     

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