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Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by GARDENHEAD, Sep 19, 2021.
If Herbert had gotten hit like Tua did, he’d have stayed in the game.
Herbert got knocked out of a game last year
Done before we get started.
People have gotten fired for drafting Bowie over Jordan, Greg Oden over Durant..
The same may come for those responsible of choosing Tua over Herbert..
What happened? Tell me the details if you recall.
Because he has super ribs and shoots fire out of his ***
Well, that is the question, isn't it?
Seeing how Tagovailoa was hit 2 or 3 times before the hit that took him out...
Seeing how many times Brisset was hit yesterday
Seeing how Fitzpatrick was hit, to include nearly having his head ripped off last season...
Seeing how many times Tannehill was hit...many of them dirty hits...
Flip a coin. I didn't see Herbert take the kinds of hits that our quarterbacks have taken over the years.
Tua might as well have played without an offensive line.
That's just the thing- you don't spend years of research to find and acquire the right QB, only to "flip a coin". We saw that movie with Tannehill and Josh Rosen...and the dozen or so quarterbacks before them in Miami. Heck, it's why we mostly benched Tua last year as well; the goal there was to protect him from our own offensive line.
This "Tua bust" talk is very premature and so is the "slow feet", "injury plagued", etc. Tua has extremely fast feet in the pocket and he's extremely accurate. We didn't lose yesterday due to slow or inaccurate quarterbacks though- the passes were on-target throughout the game from Tua and Brissett. We lost because the line couldn't identify basic pressure schemes and block the person right beside them.
I also don't agree that we drafted the wrong linemen- I think we have some studs. The real problem is that going from college to NFL level is extremely difficult because you have freak athletes that are 250 pounds running 4.5 forties that can bend and twist like a figure skater. In college you had one guy to watch out for and you doubled him the whole game. In the pros, every defender has those abilities and you have to massively step up through training and repetition.
For whatever reason, our boys aren't getting that experience as a cohesive unit and I'm not faulting them directly. We did draft strong, rugged bruisers that can fit in the NFL...I personally don't see this as a "Grier issue" as much as it is basic, fundamental coaching. The problem is identifying the blitz and picking up a free rusher, but we can simplify that even more. The real problem is setting the initial pocket. That's 100% on coaching, there's no two ways about it. The line is getting cheated and it almost doesn't matter who we drafted if they're not being taught basic fundamentals.
For the receiving corps, it's the same conversation. Drop after drop after drop. I can somewhat give Waddle a pass in his 2nd game as a pro because he was trying to do too much, too fast...he has to secure the catch and then make a play. But when you have guys like Wilson, Grant, Parker, etc that have been in the league 5+ years doing the same thing, it's really hard to just say "all our receivers suck" when we know that's not the case. It's coaching fundamentals- catch the football, secure the pass, then make a football move. I just don't understand how we have professionals that aren't grasping that. As a coach, I'd be benching players until that was abundantly clear- let guys like Hollins get the reps until then.
To get back to your point and end my rant, you can't just "flip a coin" and hope for heads in the NFL. Those fundamentals needs to be ingrained in our players 24/7 so your QB isn't getting crushed on a regular basis. Tannehill was mega-tough, maybe the toughest QB in football to be honest, and we can't hold Tua to that same standard. We don't need tough quarterbacks...we need safe quarterbacks. And that comes from coaching up a line to do their darn jobs.
No one is comparing Tua to RTH. The fact is Tua can’t stay healthy, at any level, and can’t be trusted to stay healthy going forward.
It’s too early to completely move on from him. I was skeptical before we drafted him, after we drafted him and I’ve seen nothing to change my mind that we made a major mistake picking him over Herbert or Wirfs.
That hit wasn't even a big hit, imo.
Tua simply was not worth the 5th pick.
Mando says the team fears Tua has cartilage damage that’ll keep him out for weeks.
You're not wrong.
What the team 'fears'? Sounds like click-bait. He may have spoken to someone who said that's what they fear, but that's just stating the obvious. Of course they fear that. They would first fear broken ribs. Then cartilage damage.
The only thing that matters are the test results.
The Raiders beat the Steelers yesterday. I'll be they're looking forward to us.
Pass rushers are going to be banging Tua like a screen door in a hurricane.
I was about to say they better start scheming to get the ball out of Tua's hands quicker to avoid the inevitable pass-rush...but then I realized that would involve offensive coordinators who COULD scheme or had any idea what they were doing.
I think you misconstrued my “flip a coin” comment. That was my reply as to whether or not Herbert would have gotten up from that hit. Flip a coin…maybe he would have, maybe he wouldn’t have. I just personally believe our line is so bad, and has been so for so very long that Herbert may very well not have have.
I mean Jesus, Tagovailoa was hit on 5 out of 6 drop backs and sacked twice before that hit that took him out.
I liked him too but he would have the same blocking Tua has.
I watched Herbert use his athleticism to extend plays where he was under duress. He had some mistakes too but I wouldn’t assume because Tua can’t do something that Herbert would have the same results.
Oh yeah, I wasn't pointing that rant at you. I completely agreed with your points- protect your darn QB!
That was brutal
People not wanting to say it was a big hit is about their desire to be right. Thinking that the hit being big takes the blame off Tua but it can be a big hit that shouldn't have happened that wasn't his fault and he can still be a guy whose body can't hold up.
Talking about who they should draft or who they should have drafted is fun and its less fun to say none of us are really experts and we really are just guessing but that is the case. Look at how many people including supposed experts said 49ers were morons for potentially wanting Mac Jones but now Mac Jones is the GOAT of all GOATs apparently and everyone forgot what they were saying 5 months ago.
Wanting Tua or Herbert or offensive line doesn't give you any more or less credibility to criticize the front office. They are in a much better position to know what the right players are and they are getting it wrong too often and they consistently get the minimum out of important players. Tua could be the wrong choice and still be put in a position to look good and that is what would happen if this team had its act together.
Damaged rib cartilage is actually worse than broken rib bones. Bones can heal in weeks, cartilage damage can take months.
Uh, no. My take on the hit is simply what I thought when I saw it.
I did not think it looked that bad when I watched it.
It wasn't necessarily the hit, it was being landed on. At least from the one video I saw of it. Tough break for us.
Injury prone or not, Tua isn't the guy. That much is clear. Will Miami realize it now and keep trying to address the most important position in football, or keep spending time and resources on a failed prospect?
It's not clear yet. It might be clear by the end of this season if he can't do minimum above average, but it's not clear yet.
I think the most important thing right now is finding the right coaches on the offensive side of the ball. I wouldn't be against a midseason change there either.
As far as personnel, it depends. If Tua isn't the guy, then I'd seriously consider Watson if he's done with legal troubles (which isn't clear) even if it costs a fortune. Otherwise we have to gamble on QB again. But I think the more likely scenario is Tua at the end of the season shows enough improvement to make it hard to clearly dismiss him, yet also hard to say he's clearly the guy. At that point I prioritize OL, RB and DL and wait another year w.r.t. QB.
I agree with this. ESPECIALLY OL and RB, since we've been lowballing the latter lately.
No point in realizing anything "now" because there isn't anything they can do now. Tua still has the season to sink or swim which is realistically the only thing they ever could have done.
Him not playing is really not a big deal
They have no shot winning without him.
Flores doesn't know anything about toughness. I believe the posters on here more.
They don't have much of a shot of winning with him.
How about you believe in what other NFL QBs have done? Drew Brees played with 8 broken ribs. Chris Simms finished a game with a ruptured spleen while bleeding almost to death internally. Happens all the time. QBs play with pain because that's their job and they're paid a lot of money to do it. I believe Tua is in a lot of pain. I also believe other QBs have played with much worse.
Sure they do. Do you think he's THAT much better than brissett? It's not like it's Marino getting injured