I'm always for drafting Canes, even the ones that underachieve in college, when they get to the league they work harder than anyone.

 

The #1 reason Jordan is being seen on the inside a lot in OTAs. This speed package is going to be awesome!

 

I hope we make a playoff run for Cam Wake before he is traded or leaves via FA

If OV grows Dio is Wakes natural replacement.

 

If more of these dudes start panning out, does Ireland need an apology? Like let's say...Wallace rebounded....Vernon turned into a beast....Dion turned into a beast....Koa becomes an above average Mike, Caleb Sturgis rebounds, Ryan Tannehill turns the corner, Nolan Carroll was already a success, Jimmy Wilson steps up into a nickel role, and God Forbid Egnew actually becomes a solid player, and you already have Charles Clay. At that point.....is Ireland as bad as we thought he was? Just a question.

 

Not from me. I never thought Ireland was poor at talent evaluation, I wanted him gone because he wasn't in sync with Philbin....plus we missed the playoffs because of his missteps with the oline (which had he listened to Philbin about, he'd probably still be employed).

 

Fair enough. I guess I can repose the question. Is there some redemption for Ireland if these guys start to pan out? I mean....his name was used with the likes of Matt Millen. The guy might not have been as bad as most thought he was.

 

Rds #2-4..not so good.

Add in the shroud of "one voice" means aside from 2012-13 no one really knows who he is responsible for drafting.

 

fixed

 

He was O.K. You just have to be better than O.K. to keep your job in the NFL.

 

Ireland was never as bad as people were saying. A lot of what people were saying was emotional rhetoric. The real problems to me were 1) he had the habit of leaving big problems up until game day 2) was he ever going to be that guy you make the jump into a long time contender with?

 

OV a 4th round pick huh? How does that an error like that make it to print?

 

Ireland conducted 6 drafts as the Dolphins GM. Other than Hartline and Jones, he basically drafted a lot of very average to bad talent in the mid to late rounds. I am sure if you took took a monkey and let him pick names out of a hat. He could probably select at least two starters for a team over a six year period with that many picks in the mid to late rounds.

I am glad Ireland is gone and I doubt if he will ever get another job as a GM in the NFL.

 

Ireland is a good example of a scout that should stayed a scout, talent evaluation wasn't his problem, it was people skills plain and simple. Not all players are meant to coach, not all scouts are meant to be GMs.

 

If you are going by the premise of the mid-rounds being 3-5 then you have more than just 2:

Clay
Vernon
Langford
Carroll

EDITS
That's 4/22. Around 18%. Is that a bad rate of success for mid round picks who pan out to be solid contributors/starters to a team?

 

That's excluding Lamar Miller, Reshad Jones, Brian Hartline and Chris Clemons who all start/started for us and Dallas Thomas, Jelani Jenkins, Caleb Sturgis and Michael Egnew who still have a chance to pick it up and become at least solid contributors this season, all picked in rounds 3-5.

 

OV from today: http://www.miamidolphins.com/multim...t-Season/980ae76e-b423-4200-b1dc-cb4de3e0bb34

 

Okay, Clay would qualify as a player who could be rated better than a bad or below average pick at this time. Vernon played well for part of the 2013 season, but his play faltered over the last month of the season. Langford was basically a mediocre player for the Dolphins.While Carroll played okay last year, the Dolphins thought so little of him that they replaced him with a player who hasn't played decent football for the past two years.

There is a reason this team was mediocre while Ireland was the GM. It is because he drafted and signed in free agency, mediocre talent for the most part. It is going to take the Dolphins at least another 2 years to get enough quality players on the roster to be a legitimate playoff team. Ireland was a poor GM and the record of this team over the past five years prove this.

 

Miller has't shown anything yet to justify his selection. While he is fast, he can't block and he can't break tackles. He also is below average as a back out of the backfield. Hopefully he will be more productive in 2014 but I suspect he will never be more than a very mediocre RB in the NFL.

Clemons was very average as a safety and he never seemed to make any impact plays on defense. Just because he started for a very mediocre team, doesn't mean he was ever anything but mediocre himself.


As far as Thomas, Jenkins, Egnew, and Sturgis are concerned. The fact they are still on the roster, which obviously gives them the chance to show they can be effective players in the future. Of course they also could all end up being nothing but players who lasted a few years in the NFL and never achieved any success at all. That will be determined over the next year or two.

 

I would say that by getting a lot of playing time thus far, and looking to be at worst a change of pace this season, Miller has justified his draft position. Not saying he's great, but worth the pick.

 

Langford was hardly a medicore player. Our rush defense was at the top of the league. He was so mediocre in fact that the Rams threw 24 million dollars at him. Hardly mediocre.

Nolan Carroll wasn't replaced by Finnegan. Patterson was essentially replaced by Finnegan. Carroll wasn't intented to be the other boundary corner. Patterson's injuries forced him into that role which he filled adequately. Carroll is so medicore that Philly is letting him compete for a starting gig. I mean....you might be miffed that we don't have mid/late round ProBowlers...but the truth is it's rare and these guys aren't drafted to be probowlers. You hope it happens, but if you get a solid starter, you win.

And to think that Ireland is the reason we are a mediocre team is just crazy. We've been a mediocre team ever before Ireland got here. There are a lot of reasons the Miami Dolphins don't win.......Luck of the Draw, Bad Drafting, Culture, Stadium, Ownership, Fans, Coaching....you name it. To say Ireland is the reason we are mediocre is just simply trying to find a fallguy....which is what we as fans always do to help us justify a bigger problem. We select a Fall Guy every year....demand his head on a spit....then said head gets put on a spit...then the next year our record is still average and we move on to the next fallguy.

 

Ireland is not the fall guy. He was the main reason the Dolphins have been a mediocre team for the past five years. He was the GM during all those years and he was the one constant over that period of time. The Dolphins have had two head coaches and various other coaches over that time period, and yet the Dolphins did not have a single winning seasons over the past five years.

In fact the only winning season they had was in 2008 and that was only because Parcells was able to convince Pennington to sign with the Dolphins after being cut by the Jets.

I will admit we have had some bad coaching over that period, but it was Parcells and Ireland who wanted to hire Sparano and no quality head coaching prospect seemed to want to come to Miami and work with Ireland. That is why we ended up with Philbin in the first place.

I'll also accept the fact that ownership is a major problem with this organization. The fact Ross kept an inept GM like Ireland around for six years clearly shows that Ross obviously has no concept of how to build a successful NFL football team.

As far as blaming the , luck of the draw, the culture, the stadium, or the fans for how mediocre this team has been, that is just ridiculous. While I agree the Dolphins were mediocre before Ireland got here. The fact is that he was given six years as the GM to turn this organization into a consistent winner and he failed to do so. The job of the GM is to draft players and sign players who can come in and perform at a level which will create a winning team on the field. Ireland failed to do this and that is why he no longer is an NFL GM and I doubt if he will ever be hired by another NFL team to be their GM.

Ireland may not have been the only problem with the organization during the six years he was the teams GM, but he most definitely was the biggest reason the team had very few impact players and plenty of below average players over that time period.

 

You right.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

You left out Clemons, Jones and Jerry.

The 2nd round picks everyone complains, Henne, Smith, Misi, Marshall, Thomas, all decent picks. White, Merling and Martin were busts but on the whole his 2nd rounders were far from terrible.


Ireland was a solid drafter by league standards, like Fin said he's gone bc of other reasons, not vibing w Philbin being the main one.

 

only because Stephen Ross was the owner. any other owner, like the many that compare him to Matt Millen, would have fired him a long time ago.

 

Thomas ... Daniel Thomas? A decent pick in the 2nd round?

 

I didn't stutter lol.

WADR do you ever go back and study the draft(s) or do you just arbitrarily assign expected production based on round? Thomas was pick 62, 3rd to last in the 2nd round. He's been a quality back up RB and special teams player, certainly nothing special but far from a bust or wasted pick.

Please, check the guys who were drafted immediately before and after him and then tell me he was a bad draft pick. Check the guys who have been drafted 60-70th over the past 10 yrs or so and then tell me he was a bad pick...

 

Randall Cobb, DeMarco Murray, Justin Houston, Steven Ridley. 4 guys picked soon after Daniel Thomas, all better. Two of them play RB...

And you're also leaving out the little detail that DT was over drafted. Guy is slow, runs upright, has very little power for a powerback. He's an average player that didn't warrant second round consideration, nevermind trading up into the second round.

 

Most people thought he was overdrafted, and especially so considering they traded up for him. I follow the draft very closely and had barely heard of him. Major draft publications had him rated as a 4th-6th rounder.

 

Why is there a bunch of dumb **** about Jeff Ireland in here? Isn't this supposed to be about Olivier Vernon?

 

One of the best things about Vernon's emergence is that it allows us to be more creative with Jordan. If we're going to make any noise next year..... aside from the offense's drastic improvement, it will primarily be because of these two taking the D to another level.

 

I think Vernon very much in himself is something that allows you to get a little creative. He's capable of covering pretty well given his background, but he's also good at playing 3-technique positions in passing situations ala Justin Tuck.


Towards the end of last year they ended up combining those things, with Vernon ending up as sort of a stand-up 3-technique:



So instead of the standard "sugar" blitz setup the Dolphins use frequently(showing blitz in both A-gaps) you're adding a B-gap defender who can also rush/drop.

 

There's some good shots/GIFs of OV doing this if you go to the SteelersDepot blog and go to that game as well. I think there's some of him in the Tampa Game also playing at the 3-technique spot in a 3-point stance.

 

I'd rather we argue over the new logo than Jeff Ireland's tenure. Can't wait for camp !