1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

This should be our #1 pick imo

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by nolefin, Dec 24, 2007.

Tags:
  1. nolefin

    nolefin New Member

    17
    0
    0
    Dec 6, 2007
    yesterday as i watched another debacle i sat there and thought about our #1 pick and our options, let me say i love mcfadden and i think long and dorsey will be decent players but they do dont fill our biggest need, QB and we are not ever going to do anything if we dont get a franchise qb period! after watching some tape(a noles game i had) i have come to the conclusion that we should draft MATT RYAN QB BC.. before you say no no no just watch this video and dont just look at the passes and TD's look at the guys body language and pocket presents, the guy is a leader period and he will be a good qb in this leauge. he fits the qb mold and looks the part, this sould be parcells bledsoe! ohh and dont give me this john beck crap, he has not proven anything exept that he couldnt beat out cleo, i like beck but he seems to be a backup player and we cant take the chance going into 08 with beck as our starter.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV2qlINCLnc[/ame]
     
  2. Den54

    Den54 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    17,393
    25,869
    113
    Nov 23, 2007
    AMERICA!
    I quit watching when they showed Flutie.
     
  3. Roman529

    Roman529 Senior Member

    2,643
    909
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    Colorado Springs, CO
    I like Ryan's pressence and demeanor while he is under pressure....he may not be Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, but I think that he could end up being one of the best of the QB's out there....I think Brohm and Brennan also should become good NFL QB's. I just would be a little hesitant in drafting Ryan or any other QB with the first overall pick. I think we could draft Brennan in the 2nd Round, and I think he will be just as good Ryan.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2007
  4. AggieFin21

    AggieFin21 New Member

    47
    0
    0
    Dec 3, 2007
    No QBs with the first pick please!

    Colt or Brohm would be fine in the 2nd.
     
  5. LouPhinFan

    LouPhinFan New Member

    45
    0
    0
    Nov 26, 2007
    Brohm will be better. His deep ball isn't as good as Ryan's but he's the best cerebral QB in the draft. I've watched him for 4 years and believe me the kid knows how to play football. He has a very similar skill set to Peyton Manning, only he's more mobile. Trust me the kid can play.
     
  6. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

    24,029
    40,478
    113
    Dec 6, 2007
    So you think we should use the #1 overall pick on a guy who isn't even among the top ten prospects in this draft?

    Matt Ryan is a solid QB prospect, but he's not a franchise quarterback. He's not in the same class as Carson Palmer or Peyton Manning. Matt Ryan, even if he goes 4th to the Atlanta Falcons, will be a player that gets overdrafted simply because he's a quarterback.

    Let's not forget that this guy threw something like 14 interceptions this year. He is very careless with the football.

    If you take Matt Ryan with the first pick, in three years time you are going to wish you hadn't just like Houston and David Carr, Detroit and Joey Harrington, San Francisco and Alex Smith, and Atlanta and Michael Vick.
     
  7. finfan1966

    finfan1966 New Member

    61
    0
    0
    Dec 9, 2007
    This is the reason why the fins are in the basement right now. Until we get some people that know how important the quarterback position is then we will never get that far in this league. I also believe that we must pick a franchise quarterback with the first pick. Beck is far from starter material!
     
  8. Motion

    Motion New Member

    5,811
    1,904
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    Actually it was 18 INTs and throw in 11 fumbles while your at it. :) Careless is an understatement.

    Definitely pass on Matt Ryan.
     
  9. houtz

    houtz New Member

    273
    36
    0
    Dec 14, 2007
    I'm just glad that mediocre quarterback from Florida isn't coming out this year. We'd hear all kinds of ignorant people telling us to draft his bum ***.

    If Beck isn't the answer then pick up Henne or Ainge in the later rounds.
     
  10. Roman529

    Roman529 Senior Member

    2,643
    909
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    Colorado Springs, CO
    I think the Tuna would be more willing to try and bring in an experienced QB, than drafting a QB early on. It's a shame we didn't try harder to obtain Drew Breese. Bringing Culpepper in set us back at QB for many years...and we are not going to be a playoff team until we can fix the QB spot. We just have to make sure we get the right guy, and soon. :001_rolleyes:
     
  11. Larry Little

    Larry Little Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    8,621
    2,680
    113
    Dec 16, 2007
    Nashville, TN
    Thanks for the video, but, respectfully... Matt Ryan? No, thank you.

    I'm not ready to give up on John Beck just yet. Not even close. I still think Beck is going to develop into an outstanding pro QB.

    With the talent pool the way it is right now, I'd draft someone to help our front 7. We are getting our butts handed to us in the trenches.
     
  12. houtz

    houtz New Member

    273
    36
    0
    Dec 14, 2007
    You just had to remind me about how we passed on Brees.:sad:
     
  13. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

    119
    9
    0
    Dec 7, 2007

    What exactly are your credentails when it comes to evaluating qb potential. This team is way beyond having a qb problem. The whole team is so disfunctional you can't possibly evaluate Beck at this point. If you ever played the QB position there is a lot more difficult than it looks on tv. You have so many reads. You have to process so much information in a matter of seconds. That's why you hear qbs that have turned the corner always say "the games slowed down for me". Which means they have acquired the neccessary knowlegde and experience to be successful. Granted it doesn't happen to all qbs, but all qbs need the opportunity. The coaches know that so I garauntee we aren't drafting a qb in the early rounds.
     
  14. Roman529

    Roman529 Senior Member

    2,643
    909
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    Colorado Springs, CO

    TEBOW??? He certainly couldn't be worse than Lemon and Beck. At least Tebow knows how to run and find the pylons.
     
  15. #1dolphinsfan

    #1dolphinsfan New Member

    1,664
    189
    0
    Nov 23, 2007
    u know if we draft a QB with the First pick overall and he has a bad game u guys are going to be calling him a bust just like u r with Russel
     
  16. Motion

    Motion New Member

    5,811
    1,904
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    :glare: Mediocre huh?
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2007
  17. NJ Dolphan

    NJ Dolphan New Member

    4
    0
    0
    Dec 16, 2007
    NYC
    No quarterbacks and no running backs with the first pick (assuming Parcells doesn't trade it).

    On qb's: Unless you have a can't miss pick (Peyton Manning is the last one I can think of, Carson Palmer maybe) it's just too risky a proposition. The last few qbs to be taken #1: Jemarcus Russell, Eli Manning, Tim Couch, Alex Smith, David Carr. We'll see about Russell, but I think it's fair to say that the last three either have not, or will not, live up to the billing. In the end, qbs are mostly a crap shoot. Remember late first-round and later qb draft picks include: Dan Marino, Tom Brady, Brett Favre, Joe Montana. Other decent, although non-spectacular, mid to late round qbs include, David Gerrard, Jon Kitna, Mark Brunell, Derek Anderson. Let's go down the list of top ten draft pick qbs who have gone on to be at least above-average NFL qbs:

    Michael Vick (with an asterix)
    Carson Palmer
    Petyon Manning
    Donovan McNabb
    Petyon Manning
    Drew Bledsoe
    (maybe one or two others I can't think of right now)

    Considering how often qbs are drafted in the top ten, the list is very small.

    At running back, it's just such a high injury prone position, no matter how good he is, it's almost fifty-fifty that they're going to suffer a serious knee injury in their first 3 seasons. As good as Adrian Peterson is, he's already missed three games and the Vikings aren't making the playoffs. So if it were up to me, McFadden's out.

    When you have a high pick, you want someone who is the most likely to last and make an impact. They're not sexy picks, but offensive linemen usually fit the bill. Guys like Orlando Pace and Joe Thomas both played a huge role in turning their teams around immediately. Dlineman and linebackers also have a high rate of success.

    Parcells seems to have this philosophy. He likes taking guys in the skill positions no earlier than the second round, often with a great amount of success (Curtis Martin and Julius Jones).

    So if I'm in charge, try and trade-down a few picks and take Jake Long. Try and stock up on as many late first round and second round picks as you can, increasing the overall chances of success. If you can't manage to make the right trade, take Dorsey number 1.
     
  18. houtz

    houtz New Member

    273
    36
    0
    Dec 14, 2007
    On this team he'd be no better. Yes he would've got in the endzone but we wouldn't have won anymore games.
     
  19. Larry Little

    Larry Little Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    8,621
    2,680
    113
    Dec 16, 2007
    Nashville, TN
    You'll eat those words. Wait and see.
     
  20. Motion

    Motion New Member

    5,811
    1,904
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    Based on?

    Not sure why he was even brought into the conversation in the first place considering he won't be coming out for another two years.
     
  21. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

    119
    9
    0
    Dec 7, 2007
    How does finding the endzone not translate into more wins. We all know atleast of those who know what we're talking about is Beck is going to get more time to develope. I would love to have Tebow but it ain't going to happen. Everyone says he a running qb. The truth is a good qb who can also run. Unlike Vick who is a great runner and a poor qb.
     
  22. mmikel30

    mmikel30 New Member

    188
    0
    0
    Dec 3, 2007
    in a house
    parcells likes big sit in the pocket qb's he will not draft brennan although i love brennan an we will not take a qb #1 overall i'd bet big on it.
     
  23. Miamian

    Miamian Senior Member

    6,312
    2,012
    0
    Dec 5, 2007
    Jerusalem, Israel
    I hope that we trade down. There are so many holes to fill, so many mis-Waan-steps. We haven't had a high pick stick this entire decade. I think that Beck still needs to be given a chance to show himself; the way this season has gone and the lack of a supporting cast, it's been a bit much. IMO, our greatest needs are DL and OL, right where games are won and lost.
     
  24. s55ean

    s55ean New Member

    46
    0
    0
    Dec 4, 2007
    wrong

    football teams are built from the line first...and THAT'S why we suck, because we don't draft many of them and when we do, the majority don't pan out...

    we need to draft a minimum of 4 guys on the lines, my ideal scenario would be a RT, a G, a Chubby DT, a DT switched to DEnd in our 3-4 and a OLB (arguably a linemen in the 3-4 ... )

    right on :hi5:
     
  25. nolefin

    nolefin New Member

    17
    0
    0
    Dec 6, 2007
    all these years with crappy qb's and you guys still dont get it? there are plenty of lineman and corners and wr's in free agency but why do you think there is no good qb's? becasue its the most important position! i am fine with trading down but no dorsey no long with the first pick, we need someone that will tuch the ball an impact player to score points, i say trade down or draft a qb or a playmaker
     
  26. Passrusher

    Passrusher New Member

    246
    3
    0
    Dec 20, 2007
    In the draft war room
    Not just the lack of a good QB but the lack of a run stopping defense as well as pathetic special teams and receivers who can't get open but drop the pass when they do get it thrown their way
     
  27. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

    37,392
    14,745
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    new york ciity
    Join the club. I've seen most of his games this year and this guy is the real deal. Knowing our franchise we'll draft Dorsey and he'll be out of the league in a few years because of back problems but I'm going to hold out hope thaqt we draft this guy. He's about as close to cant miss as we're ever going to be able to draft. Will he be Peyton? Probably not but he has a chance. I feel extrememly confident that this guy will be a Pro Bowler and at worst a very good QB with the potential to be great.

    Right now everyone harps on his interceptions but I think that comes from justing looking at the stats and not having seen his games. He has zero talent at the skill positions to work with and yet he's still able to make that offense move up and down the field. His college flaws are easily correctable in the Pros with a good QB coach. He loves his arm and will occasionally try to fit the ball into to tight a spot and he isnt reading the safeties as well as he should. These are problems that will be overlooked by every coach worth his salt since they are gone after one year of practice and game film

    Physically he blows Beck away, can do everything Beck does and does it better. You are right, a team's fortunes rest on finding that franchise QB, Dilfer notwithstanding. That is why QBs are overdrafted. They are so rare, that their relative value is higher than any other position. A very good QB is worth more than a great Defensive End. We're probably going to end up blowing this pick and drafting a DE. A very good Defensive End but not a solution to our greatest problem. Hopefully Beck unlocks his inner Drew Brees or whoever he's suposed to develop into and does it quickly because I fear we're going down a road of another five years of futility reminiscent of the Wannstedt days when we try to put together all the other pieces and leave the main position unfilled
     
  28. Captain lou

    Captain lou New Member

    119
    9
    0
    Dec 7, 2007
     
  29. big0mar

    big0mar New Member

    323
    3
    0
    Dec 15, 2007
    if you look back, only two QBs were drafted high and ended up becoming franchise QBs (manning, palmer)

    getting a franchise QB takes jsut as much luck as anything.

    i dont understand why some people come here and say 'we need a franchise QB'...no s##t sherlock!

    what they dont understand is that drafting a QB #1 does not mean they will be franchise-caliber, it only means they will be overpaid. and i would rather have an overpaid DE than an overpaid QB
     
  30. big0mar

    big0mar New Member

    323
    3
    0
    Dec 15, 2007
    everythign you said about ryan was applicable to tim couch, ryan leaf, jason campbell, philip rivers, and every other first-round QB bust

    and everything you say about beck was probably said about roethlisberger, brady, brees, etc.

    i agree that we desperately need a franchise QB, but if you think that using a #1 pick gives us a better chance of finding one than drafting one with the #32 pick, you are wrong.
     
  31. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

    37,392
    14,745
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    new york ciity
     
  32. Motion

    Motion New Member

    5,811
    1,904
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    I've seen him play quite a few times. He's careless with the ball, period. The stats and results just back it up.
     
  33. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

    37,392
    14,745
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    new york ciity
    All I said was applicable only to Ryan Leaf and maybe Rivers. Couch, Campbell, Akili Smith, Joey Harrington all had more flaws than Ryan. Doesnt even come close to applying. Yes Ryan could be a headcase like Leaf or maybe a cokehead and snort his way out of the NFL. So could Dorsey, Long or whoever we draft. QWe're dealing with the human component and there's never a sure thing no matter the position. Want to draft Offensive Linemen how bout Tony Mandarich or Robert Gallery. Want a Defensive End. How about Darrell Russell or Cedric Jones>? Every position has its busts. No way to get around that when we deal with the human element but there is no position that has played poorer for us this past year than QB. Name me one position that has played worse than QB


    Dont remember what was said about Brees or Brady but Roethlisberger was drafted in the first and had a ton of people who thought he would be the best of the bunch that year, myself included. The man is a monster not a little dwarf. His only flaw was he played for a small school so people werent sure if he could make the transition

    Also I am not advocating drafting Ryan because he's magically a number one. If he was slotted for the 6th round that's who I would be targeting.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2007
  34. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

    37,392
    14,745
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    new york ciity
    So lets throw nothing but dump offs and play it close to the vest
     
  35. azstryker

    azstryker New Member

    242
    1
    0
    Dec 2, 2007

    What makes any of you think Beck is anything better than Kyle Boller or Rex Grossman? Beck reminds me exactly of Grossman when he drops back, Gater fans could back me up. I see no reason why their careers won't be anything but paralel. Oh, and before you mention the superbowl, The Bears got there in spite of Grossman, not because of him.

    Finally, let me remind you that Beck is endorsed by Mueller and Cam. Could there be any better reason, aside from his horrific play, to question his future?
     
  36. TampaFinsFan01

    TampaFinsFan01 New Member

    43
    0
    0
    Nov 27, 2007
    Tampa
    I would have no problem at all if we drafted Matt Ryan.
     
  37. Motion

    Motion New Member

    5,811
    1,904
    0
    Dec 2, 2007
    That has nothing to do with being careful with the ball.
     
  38. big0mar

    big0mar New Member

    323
    3
    0
    Dec 15, 2007

    the percentage of QBs who have failed is MUCH higher than any other position. I can only think of 2 QBs who have lived up to their high draft position (manning, palmer). A successful top-10 qb is just as much an exception as an unsuccesful lineman. If the Colts ended up with the first pick in a different year, they are stuck with tim couch.

    Drafting QBs is just as much dumb luck as it is anything else. Why do you think someone like charlie frye started over derek anderson to start the season? The QB play on our team is the worst of any position by far- for a number of years. But the QB play is the worst for any position for the entire NFL. The QB position is the hardest position to project, the hardest to scout.

    To sum up my argument, no matter how good a QB looks in college. How well he performs, how well he projects, how much he does with how little talent- it really means little. There are only a few QBs every era that are 'franchise' QBs.

    So, yes, Ryan may end up being one of those QBs. He has had a great college career, and has all the tools you look for in a pro QB. But he is still a QB, and that makes him a huge gamble, as does any QB

    "Lots of teams blew it on Tom Brady, we just blew it less" -Scott Pioli
     
  39. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

    37,392
    14,745
    113
    Nov 27, 2007
    new york ciity

    I had a breakdown of QBs who made it round by round and the success ratio for QBs in the first round over a ten year pewriod was approximately 25%. The only other round that compared for some bizarre reason was the 6th round which came in just under the the 1st round success ratio. NO other round could get above 15%. If you're simply going to go by statistics Beck would have about a 10 to 15% of becoming a very good QB in this league and Ryan would have a 25% chance.

    This means absolutely nothing since football is played by flesh and blood men and I say when you see talent at the QB position like Matt Ryan or like Peyton Manning or like Ryan Leaf you draft it. Maybe we get Carson Palmer maybe we get Jeff George, but the physical talent is there with the guy. That's half the battle. Anyway since you left your post with a quote I thought I would do the same

    " Do you want to be safe and good or do you want to take a chance and be great" - Jimmy Johnson
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2007
  40. houtz

    houtz New Member

    273
    36
    0
    Dec 14, 2007
    The Tebow comment I made was because we'd have threads upon threads of people telling us why he's our #1 pick much like Ryan. The only difference is Ryan is a quarterback. I'm still trying to figure out what the hell Tebow is.

    If we draft Ryan I wont be disappointed. If we wait till round 2 and take a Brennan or Brohm that's fine too.

    I'd much rather have Gholsten , Dorsey or Long tho and draft a quarterback later.
     

Share This Page