Ryan Tannehill

"Fin-O wrote:

I am Don Lemon.

I can accept that.

"Hoops wrote:

If there are for example 6 sacks in a game and you want to tell me on average 2 of those will be on the qb with Ryan I’m fine with that.

regardless it’s not a fatal flaw. Never has been. Not when you can do everything else at such a high level.

Ya, I mean, god forbid somebody else on the team have to do their job for the offense to have high-level success...much easier to put it all on the QB...it's the Dolphin Way.

"The Guy wrote:

That depends on sample size.

Certainly the statistics from a single game could be highly inaccurate in determining the ability of a quarterback. But by the same token, you can’t very well say that Peyton Manning’s career statistics are meaningless in reflecting his ability. Obviously they mean something.

Stats show his the best season QB ever. Stats also says he was a huge choker in the playoffs.

"PhinFan1968 wrote:

You watch the most successful coaches, and they don't just pass the other areas that aren't their specialty off to coordinators and forget about 'em...Gase does. Biggest leadership fail he has shown, to me. Just listen to Harbaugh, Tomlin, Belichick, etc. They come across as equally knowing all areas, even though you know they have a specialty.

When you're the HC, you don't operate "Us vs. Them" within your team...that's up to the coordinators to have their internal competitions between the units. It's your TEAM moron...not your offense. He'll never be more than a good coordinator IMO.

Great coaches gets their teams 3 points just off brain-trust

There's not alot of good/great coaches in the league. Its honestly a crapshoot.

"Fin-O wrote:

Somewhere in Nashville you have Mariota apologists claiming he should still be the starter.

Internet message boards in a NUTshell.

Alot of Titans fans think of Mariota like how Dolphins fans think of Tannehill.

"Cashvillesent wrote:

Alot of Titans fans think of Mariota like how Dolphins fans think of Tannehill.

On the few Titans boards I've been on recently...this is most definitely true.

"Two Tacos wrote:

Not really a valid comparison to my mind. The day in and day out preparation and planning involved to have many weeks of great play vs an adrenaline spike. I'm trying, but not seeing the validity of your point.

Right, wasn't implying that Tannehill is experiencing the equivalent of an adrenaline spike, only that surges in motivation don't necessarily mean a person's baseline level of motivation is lacking.

Tannehill rehabbed two devastating injuries. He grinds. Far more likely that he actually was starting to come on in 2016, after he said the game was finally starting to slow down, and had that derailed by injuries that took longer than a season to comeback from. That seems like the simplest explanation. I like simple.

And that's entirely possible; however, it's inconsistent with the fact that he "came on" very similarly in 2014, and then dipped in 2015.

We'll know far more in about a year.

"PhinFan1968 wrote:

Ya, I mean, god forbid somebody else on the team have to do their job for the offense to have high-level success...much easier to put it all on the QB...it's the Dolphin Way.

But what if the best QBs in the league are the best largely because they experience similar quantities and qualities of pressure, but are able to evade it and extend plays and hit passes downfield at a much greater rate?

If that's true, then it doesn't really matter who we're putting the blame on for QB pressure. The point is that the trait the great QBs have of evading it and extending plays distinguishes them from the lesser QBs.

"Cashvillesent wrote:

Alot of Titans fans think of Mariota like how Dolphins fans think of Tannehill.

I think that’s an oversimplification. Had Tannehill struggled the was Mariotta has and Matt Moore came in and took us on a huge long winning streak after being dumped by his former team, I think we Dolphins fans might realize that it should have been Moore from the start.

Tennessee fans I believe are awakening to the realization that for them it should have been Tannehill all season. They’re a heart beat away from the AFC South and the playoffs under Tannehill...something that wasn’t even remotely feasible after week 5 under Mariotta

FYI Texans have a top 5 run defense this year

"Cashvillesent wrote:

Alot of Titans fans think of Mariota like how Dolphins fans think of Tannehill.

Very true, when I was in the GM League the Titans were my team so I signed up on one of the message boards for some extra insight. It really is very similar to the debates we had here. Extreme positions either way, not much middle ground.

"Hoops wrote:

FYI Texans have a top 5 run defense this year

And a raggedy ass pass defense. Could be a squirrely game.

Out of curiosity, what's that top 5 run defense based on?

"The Guy wrote:

But what if the best QBs in the league are the best largely because they experience similar quantities and qualities of pressure, but are able to evade it and extend plays and hit passes downfield at a much greater rate?

Then the QBs performance would not vary as their OL play varies and we know that isn't true. I can point you to article after article after article that discuss the impact of poor OL play on elite QBs (Brady, Wilson, Rodgers, etc). Are some QBs better able deal with pressure? Sure. Just like some are more accurate, some are better at certain passes, etc.

"PhinFan1968 wrote:

And a raggedy *** pass defense. Could be a squirrely game.

Out of curiosity, what's that top 5 run defense based on?

When capping games I always differ to YPA for rushing. Especially once you get to weeks 10+ where the sample size/relative opponents are a little less murky.

That being said, I think Henry and will be just fine today. Try and load that box and you will get Tannehill to AJ Brown up ur behind.

Texans have no true #1 CB they could possibly trust. So they have some matchup problems in my opinion.

"FinFaninBuffalo wrote:

Then the QBs performance would not vary as their OL play varies and we know that isn't true. I can point you to article after article after article that discuss the impact of poor OL play on elite QBs (Brady, Wilson, Rodgers, etc). Are some QBs better able deal with pressure? Sure. Just like some are more accurate, some are better at certain passes, etc.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2017/quarterbacks-and-pressure-2016

In the table about halfway down the page at the above link, there are 18 QBs listed with regard to performance under pressure and without pressure, in the five seasons between 2012 and 2016. Here are the z-scores for the QBs in the table, in terms of performance under pressure:

Ben Roethlisberger 1.84
Russell Wilson 1.59
Aaron Rodgers 0.83
Matt Ryan 0.81
Tom Brady 0.71
Andrew Luck 0.42
Matthew Stafford 0.19
Carson Palmer 0.11
Colin Kaepernick 0.11
Ryan Fitzpatrick 0.09
Cam Newton -0.35
Philip Rivers -0.46
Drew Brees -0.59
Eli Manning -0.66
Alex Smith -0.66
Joe Flacco -0.96
Andy Dalton -1.32
Ryan Tannehill -2.22

With the exception of Drew Brees, we see the QBs typically regarded as elite clustered at the top, meaning that they outperform the others under pressure. Tannehill on the other hand is by far the worst of the QBs listed.

So it's true that performance varies as a function of pressure, because as the table clearly indicates, the performance for all QBs was suppressed under pressure. However, the best QBs in the league show less a suppression of performance under those conditions.

The take-home message is that Tom Brady, despite that he plays worse under pressure as do all QBs, hasn't needed as good an offensive line as Ryan Tannehill.

"Fin-O wrote:

Very true, when I was in the GM League the Titans were my team so I signed up on one of the message boards for some extra insight. It really is very similar to the debates we had here. Extreme positions either way, not much middle ground.

If I was signed up in a Titans message board, I’d let them know how happy I am for them and congratulate them on getting Tannehill.

As Miami is definitely way out of the picture I’m hitching my wagon on the Titans the remainder of the season. Closest thing I can get behind to cheer for this year

"The Guy wrote:

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2017/quarterbacks-and-pressure-2016

In the table about halfway down the page at the above link, there are 18 QBs listed with regard to performance under pressure and without pressure, in the five seasons between 2012 and 2016. Here are the z-scores for the QBs in the table, in terms of performance under pressure:

Ben Roethlisberger 1.84
Russell Wilson 1.59
Aaron Rodgers 0.83
Matt Ryan 0.81
Tom Brady 0.71
Andrew Luck 0.42
Matthew Stafford 0.19
Carson Palmer 0.11
Colin Kaepernick 0.11
Ryan Fitzpatrick 0.09
Cam Newton -0.35
Philip Rivers -0.46
Drew Brees -0.59
Eli Manning -0.66
Alex Smith -0.66
Joe Flacco -0.96
Andy Dalton -1.32
Ryan Tannehill -2.22

With the exception of Drew Brees, we see the QBs typically regarded as elite clustered at the top, meaning that they outperform the others under pressure. Tannehill on the other hand is by far the worst of the QBs listed.

So it's true that performance varies as a function of pressure, because as the table clearly indicates, the performance for all QBs was suppressed under pressure. However, the best QBs in the league show less a suppression of performance under those conditions.

The take-home message is that Tom Brady, despite that he plays worse under pressure as do all QBs, hasn't needed as good an offensive line as Ryan Tannehill.

"The Guy wrote:

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2017/quarterbacks-and-pressure-2016

In the table about halfway down the page at the above link, there are 18 QBs listed with regard to performance under pressure and without pressure, in the five seasons between 2012 and 2016. Here are the z-scores for the QBs in the table, in terms of performance under pressure:

Ben Roethlisberger 1.84
Russell Wilson 1.59
Aaron Rodgers 0.83
Matt Ryan 0.81
Tom Brady 0.71
Andrew Luck 0.42
Matthew Stafford 0.19
Carson Palmer 0.11
Colin Kaepernick 0.11
Ryan Fitzpatrick 0.09
Cam Newton -0.35
Philip Rivers -0.46
Drew Brees -0.59
Eli Manning -0.66
Alex Smith -0.66
Joe Flacco -0.96
Andy Dalton -1.32
Ryan Tannehill -2.22

With the exception of Drew Brees, we see the QBs typically regarded as elite clustered at the top, meaning that they outperform the others under pressure. Tannehill on the other hand is by far the worst of the QBs listed.

So it's true that performance varies as a function of pressure, because as the table clearly indicates, the performance for all QBs was suppressed under pressure. However, the best QBs in the league show less a suppression of performance under those conditions.

The take-home message is that Tom Brady, despite that he plays worse under pressure as do all QBs, hasn't needed as good an offensive line as Ryan Tannehill.

Guess it’s a good thing that football is actually a TEAM sport. If I want to cheer an individual athlete, I’ll choose a boxer or a golfer or any other individual sport athlete, not just a quarterback

"The_Dark_Knight wrote:

Guess it’s a good thing that football is actually a TEAM sport. If I want to cheer an individual athlete, I’ll choose a boxer or a golfer or any other individual sport athlete, not just a quarterback

Whether any of us cheers for a team or an individual in football has no bearing on the importance of the performance of quarterbacks in today's game. The teams selecting at the top of this year's draft certainly aren't going to pattern their draft strategy after what any one of us cheers for.

"The Guy wrote:

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2017/quarterbacks-and-pressure-2016

In the table about halfway down the page at the above link, there are 18 QBs listed with regard to performance under pressure and without pressure, in the five seasons between 2012 and 2016. Here are the z-scores for the QBs in the table, in terms of performance under pressure:

Ben Roethlisberger 1.84
Russell Wilson 1.59
Aaron Rodgers 0.83
Matt Ryan 0.81
Tom Brady 0.71
Andrew Luck 0.42
Matthew Stafford 0.19
Carson Palmer 0.11
Colin Kaepernick 0.11
Ryan Fitzpatrick 0.09
Cam Newton -0.35
Philip Rivers -0.46
Drew Brees -0.59
Eli Manning -0.66
Alex Smith -0.66
Joe Flacco -0.96
Andy Dalton -1.32
Ryan Tannehill -2.22

With the exception of Drew Brees, we see the QBs typically regarded as elite clustered at the top, meaning that they outperform the others under pressure. Tannehill on the other hand is by far the worst of the QBs listed.

So it's true that performance varies as a function of pressure, because as the table clearly indicates, the performance for all QBs was suppressed under pressure. However, the best QBs in the league show less a suppression of performance under those conditions.

The take-home message is that Tom Brady, despite that he plays worse under pressure as do all QBs, hasn't needed as good an offensive line as Ryan Tannehill.

Simply not enough info here. Despite what you keep trying to peddle, you cannot separate the play of the OL just by looking at the numbers. There are far too many variables, including type of pressure, number of people applying pressure, time to pressure, down and distance, etc, etc.

You CAN note the difference in play of a single QB in a single season with and without a good performing OL as injuries happen, the line gels, etc.

"FinFaninBuffalo wrote:

Simply not enough info here. Despite what you keep trying to peddle, you cannot separate the play of the OL just by looking at the numbers. There are far too many variables, including type of pressure, number of people applying pressure, time to pressure, down and distance, etc, etc.

What that would mean, given the data, is that virtually all of the best QBs in the league were experiencing something fundamenally different with regard to those pressure variables than the other QBs, during the five seasons of play between 2012 and 2016.

Do you figure that's true, or do you figure the best QBs in the league are simply just better at performing under pressure?

"The_Dark_Knight wrote:

If I was signed up in a Titans message board, I’d let them know how happy I am for them and congratulate them on getting Tannehill.

As Miami is definitely way out of the picture I’m hitching my wagon on the Titans the remainder of the season. Closest thing I can get behind to cheer for this year

I’ll be rooting for them also, they get the win today and a division title looks really good.

"The Guy wrote:

Whether any of us cheers for a team or an individual in football has no bearing on the importance of the performance of quarterbacks in today's game. The teams selecting at the top of this year's draft certainly aren't going to pattern their draft strategy after what any one of us cheers for.

Define importance of quarterback play because if you’re talking about say yards thrown, Prescott, Winston, Rivers,Ryan and Goff leads the league in passing yards and yet, every one of these teams have losing records.

Touchdown passes, well Lamar Jackson and Russell Wilson top that category but scrub Jamie’s Winston and Dak Prescott are right up there as well.

While I admit the importance of the quarterback, my position has been and always will be a better overall TEAM will beat an elite quarterback every time. If that overall team includes an elite quarterback so be it but that quarterback didn’t do it all by himself and is an insult to the other 52 players on the team

"FinFaninBuffalo wrote:

Then the QBs performance would not vary as their OL play varies and we know that isn't true. I can point you to article after article after article that discuss the impact of poor OL play on elite QBs (Brady, Wilson, Rodgers, etc). Are some QBs better able deal with pressure? Sure. Just like some are more accurate, some are better at certain passes, etc.

Don't waste your time bro...eyeball comparisons are inferior and unworthy of credit.

"PhinFan1968 wrote:

And a raggedy *** pass defense. Could be a squirrely game.

Out of curiosity, what's that top 5 run defense based on?

I don’t really know but they are stout in the middle. Last game I saw they said they were ranked #3 vs it.

that dt reader guy is carrying it I think.

"Two Tacos wrote:

Questioning his motivation really seems out of left field. I cannot think of anyone doing so before you. His heart has never been an issue. Plenty of other things have been pointed at, but I don't ever remember seeing that.

As previously stated no-one is questioning his heart or dedication.

However, certain things in life can drive us to new levels we didnt know existed. That is the implication.