1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Tua 2nd most effective deep passer in 2022

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by FinFaninBuffalo, Jun 2, 2023.

  1. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    They were outside the pocket..... another fail.
     
  2. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

    1,598
    1,714
    113
    Jan 16, 2022
    This is why threads keep getting shutdown. You can't stop calling people names.
     
    resnor likes this.
  3. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

    3,706
    3,746
    113
    Jul 8, 2020
    Nah, that's the residue of waiting years for Tannehill to play well and when he did and hurt his knee, decided that rest and therapy were a better solution than surgery before having the same knee reinjured early the following season. It's not a *checking notes* loser, woe is me, I'm never gonna win mentality to recognize that you have a helluva chance to be special with a player and much less opportunity when he's off the field. Mitigating his downtime is what any smart fan should want.
     
    resnor and StaleTacos like this.
  4. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

    3,706
    3,746
    113
    Jul 8, 2020
    Every QB gets sacked. His injury vs the Bills wasn't even on a sack. Being elite can't prevent being hit.
     
  5. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

    5,758
    4,616
    113
    Jan 15, 2008
    I didn't call anyone names. I said hitman8 has a loser mentality when it comes to the Dolphins. The whole "nothing ever goes right, nobody should be optimistic, it's been 30+ years blah blah blah" attitude is not what anyone wants to hear over and over again.

    Then Owes, saying "I can see Tua getting hurt" from something he trained for this off-season comment fits right into that.

    I can't stand the negative attitude, the "aww shucks that's just our luck", especially when things are really trending upwards.
     
  6. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    Put ‘em on ignore bro
     
  7. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    I did yesterday. Looks weird to see posters have conversations with themselves.
     
    djphinfan likes this.
  8. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    Good for you…at least we can start threads and have real football conversations that have context..
     
  9. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

    4,697
    1,666
    113
    Feb 1, 2012
    The ball hangs in the air. Throws to the outside are late and behind because of the lack of arm strength which is why he throws mostly to the middle of the field. Most of his interceptions come from throws to the outside.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
    The G Man, resnor and StaleTacos like this.
  10. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Stating things like this mean you're a hater.
     
    Serpico Jones likes this.
  11. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,694
    3,739
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    League wide the Int% was 2.3% in 2022.
    Tua had a 1.7% Int%.
     
  12. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

    4,697
    1,666
    113
    Feb 1, 2012
    He threw four interceptions against Pittsburgh that were all dropped. He won’t be so lucky again next season. Also, the offensive system was figured out by defensive coordinators in the last few games which led to his struggles.
     
    resnor and StaleTacos like this.
  13. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

    3,694
    3,739
    113
    Nov 29, 2007
    No, one of those throws he was lucky not to be intercepted, the others were extreme efforts by the defenders to even get a hand on the ball. If you want to see what bad interception worthy throws actually look like I suggest you watch the Pitt QB from that game.
    Also if DBs could catch they’d be WRs. Historically roughly 50% of throws that “should be intercepted” get dropped. The way statistics work that means some games a QB will have all their ‘interception worthy’ throws dropped and other games they’ll have all of their ‘interception worthy’ throws caught. So even if it was true that Tua throw 4 balls that ‘should have been intercepted” in the Pitt game that doesn’t worry me because over the season he still had a lower actual Int% than the league average.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2023
    Striking likes this.
  14. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

    11,753
    10,252
    113
    Nov 24, 2007
    Rockledge, FL
    He had four interceptions against Pittsburgh…that were dropped. Then they weren’t interceptions!

    That’s like saying he had X number of additional receptions by his receivers…that were dropped. Those weren’t receptions. They were incomplete passes.

    Now if you want to say he had some bad passes in this game or that game, fine but to say they were interceptions…that weren’t is beyond stupid.
     
  15. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

    5,758
    4,616
    113
    Jan 15, 2008
    And, we're back to dropped interceptions all of a sudden.
     
  16. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    Tom Brady had the athleticism of turtle and ate many plays that cost his team

    But what did he do during the totality of the game, season, career is what context is about

    I can point to many flaws to many great players but without context you’re nothing but a hater
     
  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    It’s the capacity for which they can reach
     
  18. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

    4,697
    1,666
    113
    Feb 1, 2012
    He played poorly and luck bailed him out.
     
    resnor and StaleTacos like this.
  19. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    The arguments that these guys make match exactly what you would say if you were on a message board of a rival team and were ripping on their QB that just finished #1 in passer rating and nearly every other category. You'd have no choice but to move on to imaginary things, especially if you predicted for two years that he couldn't do what he just did.
     
    Striking likes this.
  20. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

    13,480
    6,235
    113
    Oct 13, 2008
    New York
    What? Get injured and miss the playoffs?
     
    resnor and StaleTacos like this.
  21. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

    1,598
    1,714
    113
    Jan 16, 2022
    LOL!
     
    Sceeto likes this.
  22. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007
    and the two posts above are complete troll jobs..

    they're laughing at yall.
     
  23. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007



    shut them up with that.
     
  24. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    I'm sure I'll get called a hater, but none of us are concerned about the games, or portion of games, that he played well. We're concerned about the games or portion of games where he, or the offense, played poorly. Looking at overall stats isn't really helpful, because it isn't addressing the issues people have. It's great, I'm glad that Tua lead the league in things. I also feel that a 4 or 5 game stretch really skewed his overall numbers. So for me, the jury is still out, while for many of you, it isn't.

    I'm not sure why I even try to engage, I'm sure the responses will be great.
     
    Sceeto likes this.
  25. Tuanon4Life

    Tuanon4Life Well-Known Member

    716
    793
    93
    Dec 23, 2022
    I think you're way too critical of Tua. Everyone has bad games. He had a fantastic season as a whole. Josh Allen led the league in turnovers last year and he lands the Madden cover in 24. Help me understand why a turd like Josh Allen can walk on water no matter what but Tua has to play 17 perfect games for people to be satisfied.
     
  26. VManis

    VManis Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    5,706
    9,733
    113
    Nov 10, 2010
    You post that you don't want to acknowledge the good plays or even his play in its entirety but rather focus on the bad plays and then wonder why people would label you a hater?
     
    Striking and Tuanon4Life like this.
  27. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

    5,758
    4,616
    113
    Jan 15, 2008
    "I don't want to talk about the positives, I only want to talk about the negatives, but I'm not a hater."

    Can't make it up.
     
    Tuanon4Life likes this.
  28. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

    3,706
    3,746
    113
    Jul 8, 2020
    From Reddit:
    r/miamidolphins

    •Posted by

    u/M_A_10
    8 hours ago


    Dolphins coach Mike McDaniel, asked on “Pardon My Take” to explain why Tua Tagovailoa is criticized more than the average quarterback.

    “There are a couple things going on. I’ve wondered the same thing, in terms of the polarization. A lot of people have strong opinions either way.

    “The starting point is he is different. Different makes people uncomfortable. If you haven’t noticed, he throws with his left-hand, not right, which is crazy because he’s right-handed. He learned how to throw left on instruction from his father.”

    McDaniel’s second theory for the criticism of Tagovailoa:

    “Throughout the history of time, people have shunned others when they can’t pronounce their last name, which it has a lot of vowels.

    “Also, there is also a lot of conviction. When there is a lot of conviction with people and they’re over the top about it, people tend to speak up on the negative. And once you dig your heels in, three years down the road, you have voodoo dolls of Tua because he’s the bane of your existence because you said you didn’t like him one time and you’re tripling down. I feel great about the guy.”
     
    Striking and Tuanon4Life like this.
  29. The_Dark_Knight

    The_Dark_Knight Defender of the Truth

    11,753
    10,252
    113
    Nov 24, 2007
    Rockledge, FL
    [​IMG]
     
    OwesOwn614 likes this.
  30. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    after leading the league in every major passing category.....
     
  31. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    You've told everyone REPEATEDLY that your only concern was injuries...... take whatever position you want, but stop flip flopping like a fish in the boat.

    In all honesty, there is NOTHING wrong with the jury still being out. But, don't make weak arguments to make your case. Having bad games is a weak argument, because EVERY QB has bad games. Those are the kind of arguments that make you look anti-Tua. You are holding things against him that are NORMAL. Tua had fewer poor games than most QBs.

    Once again (FYI) Justin Herbert had EIGHT games with a passer rating below 90. Josh Allen had SEVEN. Tua had 4 and that includes the GB game where he was nearly perfect before the concussion and the cincy game where he didn't finish. Joe Burrow and Mahomes had 5 each and they are the best two QBs (IMO) in the game.

    Also, don't deny or ignore facts to make your case. He had a league leading statistical season. Period. There is no reason to qualify or add an asterisk. He played plenty of snaps and finished the season just as strong (against the Bills and pre-concussion against GB) as he started it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2023
    Tuanon4Life and Pauly like this.
  32. FinFaninBuffalo

    FinFaninBuffalo Well-Known Member

    2,474
    2,954
    113
    Dec 13, 2007
    This is insane considering the number of games he missed.

    For years we have begged for the big play offense to be back in Miami. Nothing better than having an offense that is never out of it. Not been here since mid-Marino era. Welcome back.
     
  33. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    111,488
    67,359
    113
    Dec 20, 2007

    Ok Res because you’re the only I care about when it comes to the group you’re in, the rest are in ignore

    I thought you said you were only concerned with his health??

    If that’s not true than list your concerns about his skillset besides staying healthy?
     
    resnor likes this.
  34. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Interesting take.

    Nowhere did I say, or have I ever stated, that I don't want to acknowledge his good play. You guys want to ignore the poor play by looking at overall stats. There is no denying, Tua's 4 or 5 great games inflated the overall numbers.

    Now, if someone wants to compare Tua's drop off to other QBs drop off, I think that would be an interesting discussion. However, you want to ignore the poor games by focusing only on overall stats.

    Again, the problem here is that any concern we have brought up, you guys explain away by the overall stats, essentially arguing that his poor performances were meaningless.
     
  35. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    For me personally, I've seen enough of good play to be comfortable sticking with him, provided he can make it through this season without missing a bunch of games.

    That, however, is not in any way, shape, or form me saying that I believe Tua will be elite. That is me saying that if he can be healthy, and we have the right weapons, he can be more successful than other QBs. I still have concerns that if the quality of play drops around him that he doesn't have innate traits to raise the level of play of his teammates.
     
  36. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    The flip side is that we have no way of knowing if we would have gotten stud Tua in those games, leading to even better stats...or would we have gotten the struggling Tua, with some stinkers that further dropped his overall stats.

    The only thing we can say is that Tua missed too many games.

    Very interested to see how he and the offense do this season.
     
  37. StaleTacos

    StaleTacos Well-Known Member

    1,598
    1,714
    113
    Jan 16, 2022
    When's the ring ceremony for that?
     
    Sceeto likes this.
  38. OwesOwn614

    OwesOwn614 Well-Known Member

    3,706
    3,746
    113
    Jul 8, 2020
    You cannot smack Tua for his bad games without acknowledging that every QB has drop-offs. All plays and all games count. If, at the end of the season, a player ranks near the top of the league in passing, it's because he played very well in toto compared to his peers.

    If Tua had performed at the level he played before the concussion, he would have set league marks in several categories. As it wound up, he had a historically stellar season even with the reduced performance at the end of the year. Knocking him for not setting records and for having bad games sounds disingenuous because almost nobody plays at that level. Heck, few have played at Tua's level from last season.
     
    VManis and resnor like this.
  39. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

    16,311
    9,870
    113
    Nov 25, 2007
    New Hampshire
    Again, I addressed that. I agree, THAT discussion would be a good discussion to have. The current discussion is pointless because you all want to only look at averages and volume stats.

    This has been my problem with statistics going back decades. My position on stats has not changed, and I'm not going to change it now. Stats don't tell you the whole story, usually, not even close. So, for me, stats are a part of evaluation, but volume stats and averages can be deceiving.

    Also, I'm NOT knocking him. I'm simply saying, you cannot argue that if he hadn't missed games that his stats would be even better. His stats could have actually gone down if he had more bad games.
     
    Sceeto and OwesOwn614 like this.
  40. TheHighExhaulted

    TheHighExhaulted Well-Known Member

    5,758
    4,616
    113
    Jan 15, 2008
    Not a troll.
     
    Striking, Fireland and OwesOwn614 like this.

Share This Page