[VIDEO] NFL Playbook: Marshall Gassed on Last Series

"padre31 wrote:

With Beast, he missed year round conditioning with his hip and they targeted him so often (17 times) that his tank just tipped on "E" at the worst possible time.

It also points out that the rest of the Wr corps is lacking.

Bring on Roberto Wallace!!!

He is coming from playing a ton of games, and practices in Denver. The Humidity in Florida, Louisiana, and Texas is extremely difficult to get used to.

I did not like the play call. At the beginning of the drive we were running a no-huddle offense which is more tiring to begin with. Then Marshall catches a long pass for a big gain. And then we go right back to him?! Awful.

1st and 10 at the 11 with plenty of time and two time-outs. We should have run it. If Ronnie Brown gained 5 yards (his average) then we would have been looking at 2nd and 5 instead of 2nd and 10.

Plus if Marshall had caught the fade pass on 1st down we would have given the ball back to the Jets with almost a minute on the clock! Let's say we scored and got the 2-point conversion. After the kick-off the Jets could have won the game with a field goal. Sparano still needs to improve on his clock management. I hope he realizes that.

As soon as Marshall went out of bounds I looked at the game clock. It was around 53 seconds. I was like "Plenty of time. Give Ronnie the rock and see if he can punch it in." It's the safe call and the smart call. I don't know what Sparano and Henning were thinking.

This loss is on the coaches every bit as much as the players. I hope we learn from these mistakes and beat the Pats.

"Zod wrote:

So it was Jay Fiedler that could win in September and not December?

I really don't recall, it's been a while. I merely found something coincidental as well and used similar logic in pinning down the "demise" of our September success.

"Muck wrote:

To be fair, I think we do well to consider the state of the franchise the later years.

In '04 Ricky retired on the eve of camp and the team was in shambles overall. Wanny got fired and we surged late to finish a still miserable 4-12. The Pittsburgh game was played in a muddy monsoon.

In '07 Cameron famously went easy on the team, they were out of shape and we had a record amount of injuries. We finished a Brian Billick Christmas present away from 0-16.

The '08 Jets game was the first under the new regime. Close game against a more talented team.

The '09 Colts game was at night. Another close game against an elite team.

Your record is your record, but for the sake of argument it looks a lot better when we take into account some of that stuff. I remember the '05 opener specifically. Jimmy Cefalo told me that Broncos players were sighing, "Woooo, it's hot!"......coming out of the tunnel! Remember how Denver was spent midway thru the second quarter?

That was the last game I remember us truly wielding the heat advantage. Probably because it was the last time we were competitive until recently. :lol:

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

The temperature is the overriding reason why Ross requested night games early. A lot of people find that heat oppressive.

The night games also create excitement. If you've been to any of the recent nighties (Colts, Jets 2x), you know how electric that place gets.

OT: Probably the best game I ever went to was the 1990 Wildcard game vs Kansas City. And yes, it was at night. :)

"Zod wrote:

Ask yourself this question: When did the Nick Saban memorial bubble open?

Start your countdown at 2005 and you will see the "truth".

Could we not say then, that the talent on our team as well as the stability of the franchise has just as much impact as the heat. It's great if the heat wears down the opponent, but it does no good if we still suck and can't be a tired team. Also as others have said before it's just as hot at night. Muck you pointed out how crazy it is at night games. The atmosphere and fan base performs 2x better (the lack of a wilting heat helps that). Therefore what is more important, the heat that drains us as well or the fan base that goes nuts and gets the team pumped up. I'd say the fanbase would be a bigger advantage.

Red is 100% on the money

"GridIronKing34 wrote:

I don't think he's out of football shape, just got gassed at the wrong time. Watching that video did make me feel even better about Henne because he clearly made the right decision on those plays IMO. It's just a shame Marshall was gassed and Fasano didn't go towards the ball on the last one. He comes to the ball, then it's 1st down at the very least.

Exactly. People were wondering why Henne wasn't looking for Marshall at the end and this is why. It's hard enough when you're doubled but add in the exhaustion factor and it was smart of Henne to look elsewhere.

I'm not worried about this though. It's all about getting accustomed.

"Frumundah Finnatic wrote:

You really cant blame him for that, its 88 degrees at night with 100 percent humidity and Marshall is the new guy.

The Jets were getting gassed as well, this is why we should have pounded them with Ronnie more.

"Big Red wrote:

I did not like the play call. At the beginning of the drive we were running a no-huddle offense which is more tiring to begin with. Then Marshall catches a long pass for a big gain. And then we go right back to him?! Awful.

1st and 10 at the 11 with plenty of time and two time-outs. We should have run it. If Ronnie Brown gained 5 yards (his average) then we would have been looking at 2nd and 5 instead of 2nd and 10.

Plus if Marshall had caught the fade pass on 1st down we would have given the ball back to the Jets with almost a minute on the clock! Let's say we scored and got the 2-point conversion. After the kick-off the Jets could have won the game with a field goal. Sparano still needs to improve on his clock management. I hope he realizes that.

As soon as Marshall went out of bounds I looked at the game clock. It was around 53 seconds. I was like "Plenty of time. Give Ronnie the rock and see if he can punch it in." It's the safe call and the smart call. I don't know what Sparano and Henning were thinking.

This loss is on the coaches every bit as much as the players. I hope we learn from these mistakes and beat the Pats.

I couldn't agree more, with both of you. In fact, I was arguing (well...diplomatically debating) this point in the game thread earlier today. Big 30 yard pass play gets us to the Jests ten with 54 seconds and two TO's left, and we call four consecutive passing plays? We had them on their heels. And, Ronnie was relatively fresh. It's time to pound the rock. I mean, I just don't get it. From where I'm standing, play calling and clock management in critical situations is a serious problem for this coaching staff. It has cost us in the past (last year), and it doesn't seem to be any better this season.

"Big Red wrote:

I did not like the play call. At the beginning of the drive we were running a no-huddle offense which is more tiring to begin with. Then Marshall catches a long pass for a big gain. And then we go right back to him?! Awful.

1st and 10 at the 11 with plenty of time and two time-outs. We should have run it. If Ronnie Brown gained 5 yards (his average) then we would have been looking at 2nd and 5 instead of 2nd and 10.

Plus if Marshall had caught the fade pass on 1st down we would have given the ball back to the Jets with almost a minute on the clock! Let's say we scored and got the 2-point conversion. After the kick-off the Jets could have won the game with a field goal. Sparano still needs to improve on his clock management. I hope he realizes that.

As soon as Marshall went out of bounds I looked at the game clock. It was around 53 seconds. I was like "Plenty of time. Give Ronnie the rock and see if he can punch it in." It's the safe call and the smart call. I don't know what Sparano and Henning were thinking.

This loss is on the coaches every bit as much as the players. I hope we learn from these mistakes and beat the Pats.

#1 you score the touchdown. Period. Forget about time on the clock.

#2 Marshall was on the guy one on one and is the best player on the team. That was the right call in that situation.

......and someone is forgetting that the closer you get to the endzone, the less a pssing game is threatening. The endzone is the 12th man for the defense.

"padre31 wrote:

Zod, love Beast Bro, but Champions do not make excuses they simply perform.

Beast has to man up, know he was tired, but still if your nickname is "beast" you sorta have to live up to it, not down to it.

I hope he is raging when we play the Pastriots as going into the Bye week it would be much better to have divisional wins over two opponents rather than one.

This next stretch run of 4 games coming out of the Bye are pretty much the season.

I think the point is that BM KNOWS and will not let it happen again. Welcome to the AFCE and Miami Dolphins Football BM and KD.

Henning's take on Beast:

-expends a lot of energy prior to the game, he's like a caged tiger

-went in early at halftime for several IV's

Before games, Marshall is "like a caged tiger." He needed a few IVs at halftime because he was expending so much, Henning said

Dan Henning calls Brandon Marshall "probably the best passer on the team." Then says with a coy smile, "I want that to get out there"
10 minutes ago
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OmarKelly Omar Kelly
Dan Henning said Brandon Marshall is the best passer of his non QB players. "I want that to get out there

OmarKelly Omar Kelly
Henning said Marshall's on track to catch 128 balls. "If that's not enough he probably going to keep pouting."

Beast sounds like a wildman during pregames, and it also sounds like Henning has his hands full trying to keep Beast happy.

I wonder if Henning would prefer Drone Wr's?

:D

Watched this when it was on.....Guarantee the 1st down fade attempt is the one Henne wishes he had back.

A better true soft lob would have helped BM....thus letting the only 1on1 with no deep help be taken advantage of by BM. I say this only cause spent legs do not rehab with each successive play...so 1st down was the best chance (kind of like the best time to plant a tree was yesterday mentality).

The 2nd best scoring option on the same play since it was 1on1..was a better throw to BM's right shoulder (vs the deep flatter over the head pass Henne tossed) could have been completed since the space existed between BM and Right pylon with only the JET defender to BM's inside left shoulder.

Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda...but aside from a potential scramble to daylight to Henne's right (which seemed wide open) on one of those 4 downs...that lone inaccurate fade to BM on 1st down was the play to score on based on the coverage.

"padre31 wrote:

With Beast, he missed year round conditioning with his hip and they targeted him so often (17 times) that his tank just tipped on "E" at the worst possible time.

It also points out that the rest of the Wr corps is lacking.

Bring on Roberto Wallace!!!

i read somewhere that roberto wallace ran his route incorrectly on the last pass to fasano and brought his defender to fasano which is why he was double covered when henne tried his 4th down pass

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

Watched this when it was on.....Guarantee the 1st down fade attempt is the one Henne wishes he had back.

A better true LOB letting the only 1on1 with no deep help be taken advantage of by BM would have been sweet.

The 2nd option was since it was 1on1..a better throw to BM's right shoulder could have been completed since the space existed between BM and Right pylon.

Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda...but aside from a potential scramble to daylight to Henne's right on those 4 downs...that inaccurrate fade to BM on 1st down was the play to score on based on the coverage.

I think BMarsh was just gassed BDH, he had just had that catch and RAC and the tank was on "E", and Henne and Henning did not trust Wallace of Hartline in that situation.

We really need 1 more bonafide Red Zone threat, someone who just creates an automatic mismatch presnap, that is why I'm pulling for Wallace.

6'5 with a 38 inch vertical leap is a natural mismatch in the endzone.

"padre31 wrote:

I think BMarsh was just gassed BDH, he had just had that catch and RAC and the tank was on "E", and Henne and Henning did not trust Wallace of Hartline in that situation.

We really need 1 more bonafide Red Zone threat, someone who just creates an automatic mismatch presnap, that is why I'm pulling for Wallace.

6'5 with a 38 inch vertical leap is a natural mismatch in the endzone.

Sure he did.....but 1st down was your best chance with a gassed Marshall. I agree....hindsight 20/20...Henne had what seemed like a higher percentage of success if he throws a higher - more time to judge and leap - type pass to BM over his head....or as I say, more toward the back shoulder giving only BM a shot at it. But he was gassed no doubt.

"adamprez2003 wrote:

i read somewhere that roberto wallace ran his route incorrectly on the last pass to fasano and brought his defender to fasano which is why he was double covered when henne tried his 4th down pass

Hmm, I think Wallace's job was to run the defender deeper into the endzone to pull him off Fasano, and TBH, Henne sometimes is a little to quick to throw the ball Adamp, that is why he missed BMarsh in Minny on that flat route at the goal line.

Henne just wants to get rid of the ball quickly down there..you can see it on the first TD to Fasano on the exact same play earlier in the game..Henne got the ball out his hand like piece of flamming charcoal

first of all, wish we ran the ball at least once on the final drive at the 11. ronnie brown was fresh (small amount of carries) and imo would have been a good option there.

The fade to marshall, i wish we did a quick pass to him.....marshall 1 on 1 with the defender and no help, regardless if hes gassed, ill take marshall.

regardless, game over. lets run the ball so damn much monday, the patriots defense is gassed....and our defense is fresh.

key to victory.

"padre31 wrote:

Hmm, I think Wallace's job was to run the defender deeper into the endzone to pull him off Fasano, and TBH, Henne sometimes is a little to quick to throw the ball Adamp, that is why he missed BMarsh in Minny on that flat route at the goal line.

Henne just wants to get rid of the ball quickly down there..you can see it on the first TD to Fasano on the exact same play earlier in the game..Henne got the ball out his hand like piece of flamming charcoal

well of course, the last thing you wanna do is take a sack on 4th down with the game on the line. id rather him throw it quick giving us a chance to come down with it, rather than hold it and take a sack.....the oline was probably tired too :up:

"padre31 wrote:

I think BMarsh was just gassed BDH, he had just had that catch and RAC and the tank was on "E", and Henne and Henning did not trust Wallace of Hartline in that situation.

We really need 1 more bonafide Red Zone threat, someone who just creates an automatic mismatch presnap, that is why I'm pulling for Wallace.

6'5 with a 38 inch vertical leap is a natural mismatch in the endzone.

Dude could be huge for us.

Honestly I would have taken Marshall out of the game for at least a play after he made that great catch and run that would have been a TD if he could have run through it.

That's a very common practice. Offensive player makes a play like that, he expends a lot of energy, he needs a blow.

That first down play where you see basically a zero cover and Brandon Marshall all by his lonesome? You think that was a coincidence? The defense knew damn well Marshall had just expended a ton of energy getting the offense to where they were. He wasn't a threat.

Instead of taking him out a play and then getting two or three good ones out of him, they kept him in and got four poor ones.

And on some of those plays he was pretty damn active with his long arms and hands trying to create the necessary separation that his legs couldn't, and to be honest if Henne'd thrown it I'm sure Marshall might have caught one of those.

i still say running would have been a bad option down there. its too obvious and we werent getting the drive we needed to impose our will. the correct thing to do was to pass although i wouldve liked to seen one henne rollout in that mix

"adamprez2003 wrote:

i still say running would have been a bad option down there. its too obvious and we werent getting the drive we needed to impose our will. the correct thing to do was to pass although i wouldve liked to seen one henne rollout in that mix

The drive before the half following the Hartline catch down to the two, was the time to run from power formation - instead we threw it every down and kicked FG.....but setting up in a running formation in this last series following the Marshall catch/run Fasano block makes some sense but increases risk based on clock....it would be gutsy to run it...but we did have 2 time outs with those 4 downs. And it mirrored our power WildCat formation series that won the game last year. This year, needing to score then get successful two point conversion isnt apples to apples...but that 1st down fade was in hindsight our best chance it seems with better placement and luck.

You know, I just looked at the gamebook and I'd forgotten they still had 2 timeouts and they took them after 2nd and 3rd down. I noticed during the video when they showed the 3rd and 4th down plays, it didn't look to me like Marshall was dogging anything. He looked in fact like he was expending a lot of energy trying to create separation with his hands and arms within the 5 yards area. Now that I see the gamebook and remember we took a timeout before the 3rd down play, and a timeout before the 4th down play, suddenly I know *why* he looked like he had more energy, and it makes me more pissed off.

There's no doubt he was dogging it on 1st and 2nd down. That 1st down he couldn't run through the fade pattern and he didn't even put his arms up or jump or anything. That 2nd down, I believe that's the one where Mayock accused him of jogging.

This I blame 100% on game management by the coaches. Make that 150%.

Brandon Marshall makes a play like the one he made, to get you to the 11 yard line, most of it being on RAC...he needs a f--king blow. He's not superman. Normally you take an offensive player out of the game when he does something like that, you give him a one- or two-play blow. Why should he be any different? Because he's making more money? Yeah, THAT'S a great way to run a team. Pretend that the size of the guy's paycheck imbues upon him superpowers to go beyond normal human limits.

Get him OFF the field on that 1st & 10. Better yet? RUN THE EFFING BALL. You've got two timeouts. Run the ball, or throw it short over the middle to Bess or someone like that, with Marshall OFF the field, to where you know that you can use a timeout if the clock is still running.

That 1st & 10 play call, the fade to Marshall after he had just busted open that 30 yard RAC play where he was too tired to get into the end zone?

Stupid.

Just.

Stupid.

"BigDogsHunt wrote:

The drive before the half following the Hartline catch down to the two, was the time to run from power formation - instead we threw it every down and kicked FG.....but setting up in a running formation in this last series following the Marshall catch/run Fasano block makes some sense but increases risk based on clock....it would be gutsy to run it...but we did have 1 time out with those 4 downs. And it mirrored our power WildCat formation series that one the game last year. This year, needing to score then get successful two point conversion isnt apples to apples...but that 1st down fade was in hindsight our best chance it seems with better placement and luck.

exactly. we had the right pass dialed up on the 1st down play and on 2nd down is really the only time you could have called a run. from that distance and considering we werent dominating the line of scrimmage but instead were getting a stalemate i think passing was the only option we had. we had some good pass plays dialed up but we couldnt execute them unfortunately because marshall was gassed. if we screwed up anywhere it was in not pulling marshall but i dont know if he was telling them he was gassed. probably not so we find out after the fact

Well, Beast was gassed, in fact he was gassed in the first half and went for IV's, I think he was not available for the FG drive before the half..not 100% on that one.

The larger point is, The Staff is new to Beast and what he can do, they watched him make plays all evening, could be they thought he was fine for the final series.

He wasn't, so next game they know better, cold french fries to be sure, but it is what is.