What's Our #1 Draft Need in Your Opinion??

"hitman8 wrote:

More picks is always the better way to go unless you have a sure fire star on the board that you can't pass up.

What would you consider a "sure fire star" - all we have is guesswork and probability (inaccurate). Trading down for Odrick was a terrible move that really set us back. I can see the point, but I don't think there is a right or wrong way to do it really - it's just optimizing your situation at the time and crossing your fingers.

"danmarino wrote:

I agree about BPA. There are about 12-15 bona fide top 10 pick caliber players this draft.

If that's true, then it should be hard to miss at 11 since we've had pretty good success finding talent the past two years.

Until I know for sure Suh or Wake are gone tdef end and d tackle are off the board for me

Take a consensus top 15 guys to be drafted. Of those that are left when we pick, take the least knuckle-headed dude on the board...

"texanphinatic wrote:

What would you consider a "sure fire star" - all we have is guesswork and probability (inaccurate). Trading down for Odrick was a terrible move that really set us back. I can see the point, but I don't think there is a right or wrong way to do it really - it's just optimizing your situation at the time and crossing your fingers.

Each player is different, but a sure fire pick is a player that checks all the boxes in terms of speed, athleticism, adequate size, good character, good motor, consistent production against top competition, good tape, and good durability with no significant injury history and also fills a need.

In this draft only Barkley, chub, Tremaine Edmunds, Nelson, ward, and maybe Fitzpatrick are sure fire picks imo. Everybody else has significant question marks which is why you are better off playing the numbers game and trading for more picks. It ups your chances of having a good draft and filling more needs.

I think we should draft at least two Guards. I do not think it is necessary to draft them in the first round.

"hitman8 wrote:

Each player is different, but a sure fire pick is a player that checks all the boxes in terms of speed, athleticism, adequate size, good character, good motor, consistent production against top competition, good tape, and good durability with no significant injury history and also fills a need.

In this draft only Barkley, chub, Terrell Edmunds, Nelson, ward, and maybe Fitzpatrick are sure fire picks imo. Everybody else has significant question marks which is why you are better off playing the numbers game and trading for more picks. It ups your chances of having a good draft and filling more needs.

Ok, I see your point, though even with a question mark, I think the upside of some guys not mentioned is way higher than others.

Again to go back to Odrick, that was a disaster. We got nothing out of it, and missed out on a potential HOF player in Earl Thomas. According to you, he may not have checked all the boxes (size), but he still jumped off the screen when you watched him play. He played above his paper limitations. We also missed the mark on JPP, Brandon Graham and others who all may have had bigger impacts than Odrick.

I think it's always valuable to explore the possibility of trading down, but that in and of itself doesn't get you everywhere. Any draft strategy in a vacuum is iffy, you need to really make sure your individual assessments are on the ball and sometimes you just need to pull the trigger on a guy with a flaw if you see it doesn't limit them out on the field.

I honestly can't decide this year. TE, LB, OL, QB and WR(If Landry is out) are all big needs this year

"texanphinatic wrote:

Ok, I see your point, though even with a question mark, I think the upside of some guys not mentioned is way higher than others.

Again to go back to Odrick, that was a disaster. We got nothing out of it, and missed out on a potential HOF player in Earl Thomas. According to you, he may not have checked all the boxes (size), but he still jumped off the screen when you watched him play. He played above his paper limitations. We also missed the mark on JPP, Brandon Graham and others who all may have had bigger impacts than Odrick.

I think it's always valuable to explore the possibility of trading down, but that in and of itself doesn't get you everywhere. Any draft strategy in a vacuum is iffy, you need to really make sure your individual assessments are on the ball and sometimes you just need to pull the trigger on a guy with a flaw if you see it doesn't limit them out on the field.

Well even a good trade down strategy is not going to make up for lousy scouting. Yes there were better players picked before odrick, but there were also better players picked after odrick. We just picked the wrong guy that's all. The value of trading down is that even if you miss on your first pick you have a better chance of making up for it later in the draft with more picks. It's why Jimmy Johnson was heralded as a draft guru even though he missed on a lot of first round picks. He was all about stocking up on as many picks as possible to up his chances of finding gems like Zach Thomas and Jason Taylor later in the draft.

"Dol-Fan Dupree wrote:

I think we should draft at least two Guards. I do not think it is necessary to draft them in the first round.

And they should both be smart guys who can also play C and make the line calls. I'd be just as happy with two C who can play G also.

"hitman8 wrote:

Well even a good trade down strategy is not going to make up for lousy scouting. Yes there were better players picked before odrick, but there were also better players picked after odrick. We just picked the wrong guy that's all. The value of trading down is that even if you miss on your first pick you have a better chance of making up for it later in the draft with more picks. It's why Jimmy Johnson was heralded as a draft guru even though he missed on a lot of first round picks. He was all about stocking up on as many picks as possible to up his chances of finding gems like Zach Thomas and Jason Taylor later in the draft.

The more we move into the season the more chaos appears (gee nothing surprising there. Damn season hasn't even started).
Now rumors of Suh going,

Ndamukong Suh - DL - Dolphins
According to Barry Jackson of the Miami Herald, the Dolphins will consider releasing DT Ndamukong Suh.

wouldn't be surprised if Rashads next why would anyone want to be here with a team buried in this kind of fog with no leadership and logical direction in sight.. Not like were even close to sniffing a Superbowl....not even close...can sniff 10-6 thou whoopie...

When you are getting rid of your best players you might begin to start to feel that something isn't right. And you'd think when that starts making sense you really should be wondering...

Funny getting rid of these players at this point does make sense not like we are going anywhere worth mentioning with them, BUT what doesn't make sense is all the stupidity that has gotten this team into this piss poor situation of dismantling our friggin best players to begin with....10 mil. for Cutler / 1 year, Gase the miracle worker, Thomas, Branch and Alonso also. Bye Landry...Its enough to make anyone mad that has a clue...

OK you want to dismantle then do it and REBUILD the GD team and not this continued temporary hole replacements that goes on and on year after year. (Hint to Gase, OL pretty damn important)

Sorry I just can't see this as the formula for success and this formula is not a big surprise for we've seen it for way to long, I mean how much more of this do we need to see ? We've just become and are and will be a half azz team...And hate to say but Gase also doesn't have a clue and is there for the quick fix with little to no time line of thought for a future. If "quick fix" possible than it would make sense, but do yous really think this team is even near close for that......Hey but it does look like we will not need to worry about a lack of holes to fill and pickup an actual keeper to continue the illusion for the fans that this team is going somewhere.....ya down the toilet........

Walter actually believes that Suh and Jones are going someplace...lol..

Walter, why do you make up things in order to get angry?

"KeyFin wrote:

I know that most of us have agreed that we should go BPA and the organization says that they plan to do just that. Put all that aside for a moment though and let's talk about the #1 thing our team needs to have a great 2018. What do we really need the most?

Again, this person may not even be our first round pick, so don't worry about draft boards or who may be available. We're just talking positions....where's the biggest hole in our team composition?

Quarterback
Tannehill is a likable guy - great
Dolphins 26th in points scored at 17.6
Yes I am aware he was hurt
Tannehill by himself doesnt bring 14 pts a game
If anyone thinks he does your kidding yourself
If you wanna play with the big boys need to get an offense
Philly 29.0
NE 28.9

Just a question - how many years does a team continue to plug and play pkayers before someone begins to question the systems - js

"2socks wrote:

Quarterback
Tannehill is a likable guy - great
Dolphins 26th in points scored at 17.6
Yes I am aware he was hurt
Tannehill by himself doesnt bring 14 pts a game
If anyone thinks he does your kidding yourself
If you wanna play with the big boys need to get an offense
Philly 29.0
NE 28.9

Just a question - how many years does a team continue to plug and play pkayers before someone begins to question the systems - js

"2socks wrote:

Quarterback
Tannehill is a likable guy - great
Dolphins 26th in points scored at 17.6
Yes I am aware he was hurt
Tannehill by himself doesnt bring 14 pts a game
If anyone thinks he does your kidding yourself
If you wanna play with the big boys need to get an offense
Philly 29.0
NE 28.9

Just a question - how many years does a team continue to plug and play pkayers before someone begins to question the systems - js

" Just a question - how many years does a team continue to plug and play players before someone begins to question the systems ? "

Thats a trick question .......

Been about 18 years and still counting....

It is kind of unbelievable that this stuff is still going on a still to many just don't get it...Especially the FO..its sad....

"danmarino wrote:

Walter actually believes that Suh and Jones are going someplace...lol..

Walter, why do you make up things in order to get angry?

I did catch two "news reports" that said we may release Suh...but one was a carbon copy of the other and neither of them were on reputable websites. I simply cannot seeing us letting one of our most valuable assets just walk for zero compensation.

He does raise a good point though; how are we going to afford to pay everyone? I don't think we can without some creative accounting.

"Walter wrote:

Thats a trick question .......

Been about 18 years and still counting....

It is kind of unbelievable that this stuff is still going on a still to many just don't get it...Especially the FO..its sad....

Been a fan since I was 5 yrs old. What has happened to this franchise is criminal and then then the disease set in that competitive is all thats needed. Coaching has.never.been the same since Shula. When Jimmy came in I was as ruled up as ever - he was never truly given the reigns. Then Saban - same deal
Been patch work ever since - no long term plan

"KeyFin wrote:

I did catch two "news reports" that said we may release Suh...but one was a carbon copy of the other and neither of them were on reputable websites. I simply cannot seeing us letting one of our most valuable assets just walk for zero compensation.

He does raise a good point though; how are we going to afford to pay everyone? I don't think we can without some creative accounting.

Said that exact thing 5 yrs ago
Tannenbaum has no plan - it was win now and he exhausted all the money in the wrong places
I know you guys hate NE but please humur me and go look at their roster - there is your blueprint
The money has to be spread evenly
HOW MANY TIMES HAVE YOU HEARD NE PLUGS AND PLAYS PLAYERS
what quality of.player would you expect if Miami pays avg 1.5 yr for.linemen but.NE pays 2.7 a yr
The bluprint allows for an average overall better team - in this league the smallest edge plays huge dividends
In this league

"Walter wrote:

The more we move into the season the more chaos appears (gee nothing surprising there. Damn season hasn't even started).
Now rumors of Suh going,

Ndamukong Suh - DL - Dolphins
According to Barry Jackson of the Miami Herald, the Dolphins will consider releasing DT Ndamukong Suh.

wouldn't be surprised if Rashads next why would anyone want to be here with a team buried in this kind of fog with no leadership and logical direction in sight.. Not like were even close to sniffing a Superbowl....not even close...can sniff 10-6 thou whoopie...

When you are getting rid of your best players you might begin to start to feel that something isn't right. And you'd think when that starts making sense you really should be wondering...

Funny getting rid of these players at this point does make sense not like we are going anywhere worth mentioning with them, BUT what doesn't make sense is all the stupidity that has gotten this team into this piss poor situation of dismantling our friggin best players to begin with....10 mil. for Cutler / 1 year, Gase the miracle worker, Thomas, Branch and Alonso also. Bye Landry...Its enough to make anyone mad that has a clue...

OK you want to dismantle then do it and REBUILD the GD team and not this continued temporary hole replacements that goes on and on year after year. (Hint to Gase, OL pretty damn important)

Sorry I just can't see this as the formula for success and this formula is not a big surprise for we've seen it for way to long, I mean how much more of this do we need to see ? We've just become and are and will be a half azz team...And hate to say but Gase also doesn't have a clue and is there for the quick fix with little to no time line of thought for a future. If "quick fix" possible than it would make sense, but do yous really think this team is even near close for that......Hey but it does look like we will not need to worry about a lack of holes to fill and pickup an actual keeper to continue the illusion for the fans that this team is going somewhere.....ya down the toilet........

The roster mismanagement is the ABSOLUTE #1 thing holding this team back
Tannenbaum destroyed any future this team had and set Coach back years
These moves have to be all Mike Grier
Purging the high paid guys to bring in better talent over all is how you win in this league
Suh is not that player thar takes this team to a superbowl. Neither is Jarvis - although extremely talented - just not worth the roster disruption right now
This has to be fixed - Now or its 5 more uears of 8 - 8

"KeyFin wrote:

I did catch two "news reports" that said we may release Suh...but one was a carbon copy of the other and neither of them were on reputable websites. I simply cannot seeing us letting one of our most valuable assets just walk for zero compensation.

He does raise a good point though; how are we going to afford to pay everyone? I don't think we can without some creative accounting.

Yeah...I've seen those reports. It would be the last thing this team does, however.

Besides, Walter can't see my posts because he has me blocked.

"2socks wrote:

Been a fan since I was 5 yrs old. What has happened to this franchise is criminal and then then the disease set in that competitive is all thats needed. Coaching has.never.been the same since Shula. When Jimmy came in I was as ruled up as ever - he was never truly given the reigns. Then Saban - same deal
Been patch work ever since - no long term plan

I gotcha

Been a fan, and there the very first Game in the Orange Bowl (George Auer TD).
Damn I have to say how nice it is to even see someone with that similar mind blowing astonishment at the ineptitude that hasn't slowed a step since the Wanny days. I mean its weird people don't see this ineptitude pretty much at all. Or they don't understand the seriousness of it.
There is no long term view or plan what so ever. Thats a HUGE sign of it own....

Oh well starting to get used to it and develop the same low standards ..I seen and lived through the great days and it was amazing...

"2socks wrote:

The roster mismanagement is the ABSOLUTE #1 thing holding this team back
Then you have Tannenbaum destroying any future this team had
These moves have to be all Mike Grier
Purging the high paid guys to bring in better talent over all is how you win in this league
Suh is not that player thar takes this team to a superbowl. Neither is Jarvis - although extremely talented - just not worth the roster disruption right now
This has to be fixed - Now or its 5 more uears of 8 - 8

This league wins by pressure up the middle. Suh gives you pressure up the middle and you're not going to get anybody to do it better for any cheaper.

(In before I get those who won't understand my post.)

Yes, there are other DT's in the league who can put pressure on the QB and a couple who do it better than Suh. Aaaron Donald being one, but I'm curious as to what he's going to make after his rookie contract is up. However, those players are not and will not be available.

"Walter wrote:

I gotcha

Been a fan, and there the very first Game in the Orange Bowl (George Auer TD).
Damn I have to say how nice it is to even see someone with that similar mind blowing astonishment at the ineptitude that hasn't slowed a step since the Wanny days. I mean its weird people don't see this ineptitude pretty much at all. Or they don't understand the seriousness of it.
There is no long term view or plan what so ever. Thats a HUGE sign of it own....

Oh well starting to get used to it and develop the same low standards ..I seen and lived through the great days and it was amazing...

There are alot of good guys and gals on here. Passionate!! They hate anything remotely negative. The problem is it becomes very hard to have a reasonable conversation because your beat down for being a trader. Hell if you dont recognize your weak spots because your wearing the rosey glasses and refuse to admit maybe - just maybe the team doesnt really have a good good chance at winning enough to actually achieve the goal of a superbowl trophy then how do you discuss what really needs to be corrected??
Hell guys are si desperate they are resorting to graphs and charts to show how if Tannehill plays like 2013 we can expect a .0000013472 possibilty of winning for every point he scores. I mean not meant.to bash anybody but.- geez really. The two teams arent even.the same. There are so many variables to consider that any attempt at a comparison is frugal.
It really isnt rocket science - as some want to.convince others it is. Sometimes its as simple as being able to critique yourself - honestly. Hard for a lot of.people
Keep up the fight Dude - enjoy your.posts

Putting.pressure up the middle is a way to win - dont disagree
Can we first start at.ground zero??
The roster is a mess

Why are you here 2socks? Let's all remember this post of yours before taking you seriously:
https://www.thephins.com/threads/state-of-the-franchise.92306/page-4#post-3005361

So I have defected and I've been following the New England Patriots the last 3 or 4 yrs. At least playoff conversations actually have meaning. I wish you all well . Good luck with the mediocre train wreck known as the Miami Dolphins. Thought I'd never say that. But, after 40 + yrs of **** I'm over it.

Don't act like you want the Dolphins to succeed.

"cbrad wrote:

Why are you here 2socks? Let's all remember this post of yours before taking you seriously:
https://www.thephins.com/threads/state-of-the-franchise.92306/page-4#post-3005361

Don't act like you want the Dolphins to succeed.

Of course I do
Always a fin fan
And yes I am following the Patriots
Dont be afraid to go take a serious look at what excellence looks like
Might help you realize how off this management really is and what it will take to over take the Patriots finally
Do you enjoy 18 yrs of mediocrity??
I dont.
Hey do me a favor
Go back and review a lot of my posts and youll see i was right - most of what I predicted came true - especially how the Suh deal would handicap this team for 5 yrs - preventing it form winning and that 2018 would be the year it all fell apart.
Thank God Mike Greer sees the light
This roster will be purged and the wealth spread thruout the roster
Better average players across the board produces better overall team