Why not Jason Allen at free safety?

:sidelol: He prefaces his argument by obliterating it with evidence to the contrary...

I’m well aware that former Miami Dolphins first-round pick Jason Allen has had too many position switches to even count.

Cornerback to safety. Safety to cornerback. Cornerback to safety, and back again. However, I’m recommending another

"I realize that the glass doesn't hold water adequately, and that it's been tried in the past... all I'm saying is, let's try it again..."

This kid will never be successful unless he ends up in a Belichek/Saban style of secondary. What's going to happen, is that we will try him at FS again, change what he's been doing for the last year and if he isn't great, he'll get cut and NE will pick him up and he'll be very successful for them. I don't know enough about how Nolan works his secondary coverage in, but Allen should never have been moved from FS to begin with...It may just be too late for him now...here at least...

Jason Allen will be OJ Atogwe's towel boy come June 1st.

"Vinny Fins wrote:

Jason Allen will be OJ Atogwe's towel boy come June 1st.

Maybe, but that'll be a lot of money to pay for a guy that is just a little bit better than average FS...

Didn't he also just have surgery on a hernia or something?

jason allen is better suited to play CB
moving him again would be foolish

Keep him at cb. He is a decent backup if someone gets hurt.

Jason is on a career upswing
& should be considered along w/ Will Allen
as an experienced free safety alternative
I've brought the both of them up in other posts
a couple of times before this thread.
it only makes sense to me. :yes:

last posted on subject:

'one veteran in the defensive backfield, a rookie & two newbies, wouldn't want to set to sea in that ship. need experience @ free safety, potential & talent are not enough to win games. its our last line of defense & sports the best vision of the field for making calls during the game. my best guess would be a healthy Will Allen, even a Jason Allen on a career upswing enters the fray... still two more quality veterans may come available before the opener. something has to & will be done or the season will fall short of desired outcomes. not much to fix a position away from a run on the BigEnchillada...' Rio

Jason Allen has all the intangibles: size, speed, aggression & ball skills. after a slow & confusing start he has shown signs of life & promise. couple this w/ the NFL experience he has acquired & he becomes a serious consideration @ FS, a position he played throughout college. :up:

Can anyone honestly remember Allen playing poorly (when he was actually in the game)?

Except for a long TD against Marshall that was called back due to offensive PI, I can't remember him getting beat. I think Randy Moss abused him in one game in 08', but Randy Moss abuses everyone.

"Killerphins wrote:

jason allen is better suited to play CB
moving him again would be foolish

Actually, I disagree there. He was a FS coming out of college. That's his natural position. He's blessed somewhat with the curse of being flexible enough to not be poor at either position. He played both positions for Saban at LSU and was moved around alot here his first season. After that, the other regimes tried to force him into one position or another, but FS is by far his forte, imho. He's just not a great press guy, that you'd want as a CB.

On an aside, does anyone know enough about Nolan as to how he works his secondary...I mean, are they a quarters style, that Pasqueloni tried to make us last season, with some success or is he a press-man corner cover with safeties at centerfield...I don't know enough. His other stops, sans San Fran, have featured pretty good FS's, that allowed him some flexibility...

I may be wrong, but thought we drafted him out of Tennessee. I would give him a try though. He is great on Special Teams and if he could give us some time as FS, why not.

Jason Allen has never been that bad of a player in my mind...he's made some mistakes but what young DB doesn't? He's older, more experienced and i say he deserves a shot to be more of a contributer.

Also, there's gotta be a reason he hasn't been cut yet. And don't say because he's great on ST. There are a lot of guys who are great on ST that do nothing else.

"Larryfinfan wrote:

Actually, I disagree there. He was a FS coming out of college. That's his natural position. He's blessed somewhat with the curse of being flexible enough to not be poor at either position. He played both positions for Saban at LSU and was moved around alot here his first season. After that, the other regimes tried to force him into one position or another, but FS is by far his forte, imho. He's just not a great press guy, that you'd want as a CB.

On an aside, does anyone know enough about Nolan as to how he works his secondary...I mean, are they a quarters style, that Pasqueloni tried to make us last season, with some success or is he a press-man corner cover with safeties at centerfield...I don't know enough. His other stops, sans San Fran, have featured pretty good FS's, that allowed him some flexibility...

Sorry, wrong.

"larfo2224 wrote:

I may be wrong, but thought we drafted him out of Tennessee. I would give him a try though. He is great on Special Teams and if he could give us some time as FS, why not.

Correcto my man.

As JA has now been given the chance to do everything possible for someone drafted at #16, only 7 spots lower than TG, if we must live with the thought of another season with him I take great pleasure in giving him the water boys' job. I know he's overpaid but thats true no matter the job he's given!:pity:

The question with J. Allen has always been intelligence. He has everything else you'd want in a FS. I've felt that if he ever got the chance to stay there he'd eventually excel. I mean Vinny Testaverde was dumb as a rock and eventually even he was thought of as a "smart" QB. If anyone sees something enough times even a guy with intelligence questions can figure it out.

"the 23rd wrote:

Jason is on a career upswing...

Agreed. I thought this was agreed upon at the end of last year. The past 2 years he's been a solid contributor. Is he over paid? Yes, but thats up to the front office.

"Larryfinfan wrote:

Actually, I disagree there. He was a FS coming out of college. That's his natural position. He's blessed somewhat with the curse of being flexible enough to not be poor at either position. He played both positions for Saban at LSU and was moved around alot here his first season. After that, the other regimes tried to force him into one position or another, but FS is by far his forte, imho. He's just not a great press guy, that you'd want as a CB.

On an aside, does anyone know enough about Nolan as to how he works his secondary...I mean, are they a quarters style, that Pasqueloni tried to make us last season, with some success or is he a press-man corner cover with safeties at centerfield...I don't know enough. His other stops, sans San Fran, have featured pretty good FS's, that allowed him some flexibility...

first of all you lost me because JA didn't play for Saban at LSU

if he is a better fit to play safety then why is he a CB now. I think they see him more suited for that position and he filled in nicely there when called upon to do so. with such a need at safety if they felt comfortable with him back there chances are he would be back there. regardless of what position he played in college JA is where he should be position wise. moving him again doesn't help anyone it just creates another void while not filling an existing one.

"the 23rd wrote:

Jason is on a career upswing
& should be considered along w/ Will Allen
as an experienced free safety alternative

I felt this way too until we lost nate jones. after that happened there is no way
will allen will be the nickel corner now

"Killerphins wrote:

first of all you lost me because JA didn't play for Saban at LSU

if he is a better fit to play safety then why is he a CB now. I think they see him more suited for that position and he filled in nicely there when called upon to do so. with such a need at safety if they felt comfortable with him back there chances are he would be back there. regardless of what position he played in college JA is where he should be position wise. moving him again doesn't help anyone it just creates another void while not filling an existing one.

IMO he has the athleticism needed for CB and in our system and most systems CB requires less thinking than S. If he gets over the hump on the thinking part then IMO he'll be at least as suited to play FS, probably more due to his straight-line speed, than CB.

I also think we have a bigger hole at FS than at CB. I think we have three guys at CB in Davis, Smith and W. Allen capable of playing at a pro bowl level. I don't see anybody with that level of ability at FS. Bell is capable of playing at a pro bowl level at SS but not FS. Culver is capable of being a functional starter. Clemons and Jones are guys we hope will develop.

"rafael wrote:

IMO he has the athleticism needed for CB and in our system and most systems CB requires less thinking than S. If he gets over the hump on the thinking part then IMO he'll be at least as suited to play FS, probably more due to his straight-line speed, than CB.

I also think we have a bigger hole at FS than at CB. I think we have three guys at CB in Davis, Smith and W. Allen capable of playing at a pro bowl level. I don't see anybody with that level of ability at FS. Bell is capable of playing at a pro bowl level at SS but not FS. Culver is capable of being a functional starter. Clemons and Jones are guys we hope will develop.

i'm with you rafael i think JA struggles with reacting at the s position because his thought process is a little slow and he doesn't have to do that at corner as much. which is why i stated he is better suited for that position. as far as the FS position we are definitely lacking but as far as things stand right now I see culver getting the start. he just might turn out to be the answer. clemons looked lost in coverage when we saw him out there and jones although he says he will be the starter we know it will take some time and he just might eventually be bell's replacement meaning another SS.

I really liked J Allen's play last year - I think he's a very good nickel back (should have been the nickel instead of the dime, imo, last year). With Will Allen back, I think Allen will be the dime.

I also would not mind trying him at FS. He obviously knows how to cover and surely by now, as a veteran who has also been in this defense for 3 seasons, he should be intelligent enough to play at S.

"the 23rd wrote:

Jason is on a career upswing
& should be considered along w/ Will Allen
as an experienced free safety alternative
I've brought the both of them up in other posts
a couple of times before this thread.
it only makes sense to me. :yes:

last posted on subject:

'one veteran in the defensive backfield, a rookie & two newbies, wouldn't want to set to sea in that ship. need experience @ free safety, potential & talent are not enough to win games. its our last line of defense & sports the best vision of the field for making calls during the game. my best guess would be a healthy Will Allen, even a Jason Allen on a career upswing enters the fray... still two more quality veterans may come available before the opener. something has to & will be done or the season will fall short of desired outcomes. not much to fix a position away from a run on the BigEnchillada...' Rio

Jason Allen has all the intangibles: size, speed, aggression & ball skills. after a slow & confusing start he has shown signs of life & promise. couple this w/ the NFL experience he has acquired & he becomes a serious consideration @ FS, a position he played throughout college. :up:

I really wish you'd stop with the funky colors and weird fonts. You usually have insightful posts, I just can't get through them.

We yanked him around enough. Even this FO recognized he was yanked around, and declared that JA will no longer be yanked around. They then decided to yank him one more time (no homo).

I dare you to use the word yank more than I just did.

Let him fricking develop at a position mmkay.

"Larryfinfan wrote:

Actually, I disagree there. He was a FS coming out of college. That's his natural position. He's blessed somewhat with the curse of being flexible enough to not be poor at either position. He played both positions for Saban at LSU and was moved around alot here his first season. After that, the other regimes tried to force him into one position or another, but FS is by far his forte, imho. He's just not a great press guy, that you'd want as a CB.

On an aside, does anyone know enough about Nolan as to how he works his secondary...I mean, are they a quarters style, that Pasqueloni tried to make us last season, with some success or is he a press-man corner cover with safeties at centerfield...I don't know enough. His other stops, sans San Fran, have featured pretty good FS's, that allowed him some flexibility...

I've been thinking about that, as it will impact the Safety debate.

I think our talent is suited to man coverage underneath two zone safeties over the top. I would not trust ANY of our safeties in a quarters scheme. They don;t have good enough judgement nor ability to stick with a WR.

Put our best CB's out there in press man coverage, let Bell and JOnes/Allen/Culver be the high zone safety net behind them.

That's lowest risk and plays to the roster's strength.