WR's who make the team

"PSG wrote:

Am I the only one who thinks Hartline could/should be the odd man out?

no :shifty:

"phinsational wrote:

I think Fuller will regain his 2010 form that merited 1st round potential. It's not like he's blown out a wheel or something of that serious nature; the talent's still there. Heck, he still made some 1st round caliber plays last year IMO.

When his mind is focused it seems like he can do just about anything, so perhaps not having him on the field constantly will allow him to make a bigger and more consistent impact when he is on the field. Just a thought.

He played through hamstring and concussion issues in 2011. He suffered a stress fracture in his foot at the Senior Bowl practices, which kept him from doing anything but the bench press at the combine.
He has fine physical tools, and the receiving ability. He has an NFL pedigree. His dad was such a hard hitter it led Ronnie Lott to say he was the best in that regard he'd ever seen. I'm pretty sure his physical nature and disregard for personal preservation led to his having only about 5 years in the league. A spinal injury ended the career early of Jeff Sr.

"Fin-Omenal wrote:

I think a healthy Hartline starts at split end with #1 potential....but he needs to be healthy or their may not be a spit for him here. What a great preseason we are in for, so much to be evaluated.

I don't think he can stay healthy in this system. That's just it. He's not a fit. His RAC ability is limited. The expectation is that the Philbin/Sherman offense is going to ask receivers to catch the ball on slants, quick release passes, over the middle and that's not something Hartline can do consistently without getting destroyed.

"GridIronKing34 wrote:

I think you're crazy. Camarillo we knew he had a lot of limitations. I don't see those same limitations in Hartline. Just IMO.

I'll agree with that. The two are different, but their training camp situations are similar... new regime, new quarterbacks, new system, both receivers have been (were) limited in training camp. Now their salary situation is different. Camarillo had just signed a new contract the season before. Hartline is a free agent next year. But we were able to dump Cam's contract on Spielman and the Vikings.

You know what's funny about this wide receivers unit? Let's say Brian Hartline, Davone Bess, Chad Johnson, Julius Pruitt and Jeff Fuller make the team. Let's say that in reality, Jeff Fuller is more the #4 receiver than Julius Pruitt, who is "the best special teams player" Darren Rizzi says he ever coached.

WR Davone Bess: 4.64
TE Anthony Fasano: 4.72

WR Chad Johnson: 4.57
TE Charles Clay: 4.69

WR Jeff Fuller: 4.53
TE Michael Egnew: 4.48

WR Brian Hartline: 4.52
TE Les Brown: 4.43

Average WR: 4.565
Average TE: 4.580

Our tight ends unit is practically just as fast as our wide receivers unit, lol.

"ckparrothead wrote:

You know what's funny about this wide receivers unit? Let's say Brian Hartline, Davone Bess, Chad Johnson, Julius Pruitt and Jeff Fuller make the team. Let's say that in reality, Jeff Fuller is more the #4 receiver than Julius Pruitt, who is "the best special teams player" Darren Rizzi says he ever coached.

WR Davone Bess: 4.64
TE Anthony Fasano: 4.72

WR Chad Johnson: 4.57
TE Charles Clay: 4.69

WR Jeff Fuller: 4.53
TE Michael Egnew: 4.48

WR Brian Hartline: 4.52
TE Les Brown: 4.43

Average WR: 4.565
Average TE: 4.580

Our tight ends unit is practically just as fast as our wide receivers unit, lol.

Ck, where did you get that 4.52 from fuller? Just curious.

"ckparrothead wrote:

You know what's funny about this wide receivers unit? Let's say Brian Hartline, Davone Bess, Chad Johnson, Julius Pruitt and Jeff Fuller make the team. Let's say that in reality, Jeff Fuller is more the #4 receiver than Julius Pruitt, who is "the best special teams player" Darren Rizzi says he ever coached.

WR Davone Bess: 4.64
TE Anthony Fasano: 4.72

WR Chad Johnson: 4.57
TE Charles Clay: 4.69

WR Jeff Fuller: 4.53
TE Michael Egnew: 4.48

WR Brian Hartline: 4.52
TE Les Brown: 4.43

Average WR: 4.565
Average TE: 4.580

Our tight ends unit is practically just as fast as our wide receivers unit, lol.

That's funny.

Another point to be made would be that the UDFA made the team over the 3 drafted receivers(Matthews, Cunningham, Gates). Ireland:pity:

Johnson
Bess
Wallace
Fuller
Hartline
Moore/ Pruitt..

Practice squad...Bj, Rishard Matthews.

I'm having a little trouble with the idea of keeping 6 wide receivers.

-Reggie Bush can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Charles Clay can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Michael Egnew can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Even Lamar Miller has been tried split out wide like a receiver.
-If Les Brown is kept he will most assuredly be split out wide like a receiver.

So why do you need 6 untalented wide receivers? What talented players are you cutting from the roster in order to do that? Why are we discriminating against said talented players at other positions, and in favor of the wide receivers? Just because it's a sexier position?

"ckparrothead wrote:

You know what's funny about this wide receivers unit? Let's say Brian Hartline, Davone Bess, Chad Johnson, Julius Pruitt and Jeff Fuller make the team. Let's say that in reality, Jeff Fuller is more the #4 receiver than Julius Pruitt, who is "the best special teams player" Darren Rizzi says he ever coached.

WR Davone Bess: 4.64
TE Anthony Fasano: 4.72

WR Chad Johnson: 4.57
TE Charles Clay: 4.69

WR Jeff Fuller: 4.53
TE Michael Egnew: 4.48

WR Brian Hartline: 4.52
TE Les Brown: 4.43

Average WR: 4.565
Average TE: 4.580

Our tight ends unit is practically just as fast as our wide receivers unit, lol.

Let's say though that Pruitt also plays as the #4 WR. He is a legit 4.4 guy at the least, right?

"djphinfan wrote:

Ck, where did you get that 4.52 from fuller? Just curious.

4.53 was his pro day 40 time.
That was last March 7th. He'd just come off a stress fracture in his foot from the Senior Bowl, so probably wasn't able to already run his best by March 7 either.

"MrClean wrote:

Let's say though that Pruitt also plays as the #4 WR. He is a legit 4.4 guy at the least, right?

Yessir. He has 4.40 speed. So does Legedu Naanee, though he's never been a deep threat in his career.

"MrClean wrote:

4.53 was his pro day 40 time.
That was last March 7th. He'd just come off a stress fracture in his foot from the Senior Bowl, so probably wasn't able to already run his best by March 7 either.

And it was probably a friendly estimate, to be honest. I don't know if I see 4.53 on the football field with him. But then you could probably say the same about Fasano's 4.72 (although I personally find it believable), or Les Brown's 4.43.

"ckparrothead wrote:

I'm having a little trouble with the idea of keeping 6 wide receivers.

-Reggie Bush can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Charles Clay can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Michael Egnew can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Even Lamar Miller has been tried split out wide like a receiver.
-If Les Brown is kept he will most assuredly be split out wide like a receiver.

So why do you need 6 untalented wide receivers? What talented players are you cutting from the roster in order to do that? Why are we discriminating against said talented players at other positions, and in favor of the wide receivers? Just because it's a sexier position?

I think I would rather keep 4 TEs than 6 Wrs, at-least from this group

Joe Philbin's ideals on defense are to keep 8 DLs, 7 LBs and 10 DBs. That's what he told his coaches when he asked them each to formulate their own 53 man roster. That leaves 25 spaces on offense. If you're keeping 3 QBs, that's 22 spaces. The bare minimum you can keep on OL is 8. That leaves 14 spaces for TEs, RBs and WRs. Say you keep 3 TEs, down to 11 spots for RBs and WRs. That leaves you the ability to keep 5 RBs/FBs (a normal amount) and 6 WRs...but it means that 6th WR came at the expense of a 9th OL (which is probably average) and/or a 4th TE.

So really it's going to come down to whether you you're healthy enough on OL to feel like you have your bases covered injury-wise with Lydon Murtha, Eric Steinbach and perhaps Josh Samuda as your only backups...and whether that 9th OL (Dustin Waldron, Andrew McDonald, John Jerry, Will Barker or Ray Feinga), or that 4th TE (Les Brown), or that 9th DL (Derrick Shelby, Jarrell Root, Jacquies Smith, Ryan Baker).

If you've already got Julius Pruitt on roster, I don't see how a Roberto Wallace wins that extra roster spot over one of the DLs, a 9th OL or a Les Brown. Likewise the other way around, if Wallace gets the job with his combination of STs play and promise as a receiver...how/why do you keep Pruitt? Who shows more promise, Jeff Fuller, Rishard Matthews, B.J. Cunningham or Clyde Gates? Do you really need Legedu Naanee on roster if you've got Brian Hartline healthy again along with Davone Bess and Chad Johnson?

"MrClean wrote:

He played through hamstring and concussion issues in 2011. He suffered a stress fracture in his foot at the Senior Bowl practices, which kept him from doing anything but the bench press at the combine.

That's what I'm saying---- there was nothing to leave him permanently damaged causing him to fall to rookie FA status.

"ckparrothead wrote:

You know what's funny about this wide receivers unit? Let's say Brian Hartline, Davone Bess, Chad Johnson, Julius Pruitt and Jeff Fuller make the team. Let's say that in reality, Jeff Fuller is more the #4 receiver than Julius Pruitt, who is "the best special teams player" Darren Rizzi says he ever coached.

WR Davone Bess: 4.64
TE Anthony Fasano: 4.72

WR Chad Johnson: 4.57
TE Charles Clay: 4.69

WR Jeff Fuller: 4.53
TE Michael Egnew: 4.48

WR Brian Hartline: 4.52
TE Les Brown: 4.43

Average WR: 4.565
Average TE: 4.580

Our tight ends unit is practically just as fast as our wide receivers unit, lol.

:lol:

:sad:

"PhinsRDbest wrote:

That's funny.

Another point to be made would be that the UDFA made the team over the 3 drafted receivers(Matthews, Cunningham, Gates). Ireland:pity:

yeah but he would make it over a lot of teams' drafted receivers.

"ckparrothead wrote:

So why do you need 6 untalented wide receivers? What talented players are you cutting from the roster in order to do that? Why are we discriminating against said talented players at other positions, and in favor of the wide receivers? Just because it's a sexier position?

I was just thinking the same thing. With only 2 WRs on the field on much occasion, why do we need 6?

No Cunningham? Will he be PS bound?

"ckparrothead wrote:

Joe Philbin's ideals on defense are to keep 8 DLs, 7 LBs and 10 DBs. That's what he told his coaches when he asked them each to formulate their own 53 man roster. That leaves 25 spaces on offense. If you're keeping 3 QBs, that's 22 spaces. The bare minimum you can keep on OL is 8. That leaves 14 spaces for TEs, RBs and WRs. Say you keep 3 TEs, down to 11 spots for RBs and WRs. That leaves you the ability to keep 5 RBs/FBs (a normal amount) and 6 WRs...but it means that 6th WR came at the expense of a 9th OL (which is probably average) and/or a 4th TE.

So really it's going to come down to whether you you're healthy enough on OL to feel like you have your bases covered injury-wise with Lydon Murtha, Eric Steinbach and perhaps Josh Samuda as your only backups...and whether that 9th OL (Dustin Waldron, Andrew McDonald, John Jerry, Will Barker or Ray Feinga), or that 4th TE (Les Brown), or that 9th DL (Derrick Shelby, Jarrell Root, Jacquies Smith, Ryan Baker).

If you've already got Julius Pruitt on roster, I don't see how a Roberto Wallace wins that extra roster spot over one of the DLs, a 9th OL or a Les Brown. Likewise the other way around, if Wallace gets the job with his combination of STs play and promise as a receiver...how/why do you keep Pruitt? Who shows more promise, Jeff Fuller, Rishard Matthews, B.J. Cunningham or Clyde Gates? Do you really need Legedu Naanee on roster if you've got Brian Hartline healthy again along with Davone Bess and Chad Johnson?

That kinda sticks out, 6 CB and 4 S?

"PhinsRDbest wrote:

That's funny.

Another point to be made would be that the UDFA made the team over the 3 drafted receivers(Matthews, Cunningham, Gates). Ireland:pity:

So who gets credit for the UDFA?

"xphinfanx wrote:

So who gets credit for the UDFA?

It's hard to know unless you have insider knowledge.

Ireland could have just signed him.
Sherman could have requested they sign him.
Tannehill could have suggested they sign him.
Another scout could have been banging the table for him like Bess.

"PhinsRDbest wrote:

That kinda sticks out, 6 CB and 4 S?

Probably 5 and 5. Your defensive backs constitute a big part of your special teams, too.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Ireland gets credit for the good UDFA just as he'd get credit for the bad 1st rounder.

"ckparrothead wrote:

I'm having a little trouble with the idea of keeping 6 wide receivers.

-Reggie Bush can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Charles Clay can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Michael Egnew can and will be split out wide like a receiver.
-Even Lamar Miller has been tried split out wide like a receiver.
-If Les Brown is kept he will most assuredly be split out wide like a receiver.

So why do you need 6 untalented wide receivers? What talented players are you cutting from the roster in order to do that? Why are we discriminating against said talented players at other positions, and in favor of the wide receivers? Just because it's a sexier position?

At this point, which is ridiculously early, and all guesswork,I'm thinking about who would be the more talented player to fill out their respected unit, I think there is deeper talent at receiver than the other units, but that could change in the games..