Right behind the Jets...
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000496901/article/ranking-nfl-backfields-from-no-1-to-32
-just a little blurb on Ajayi
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Sounds about right...when Gordon wins rookie of the year we'll really be kicking ourselves.
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PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member
If he stinks it up, can we kick you?Fin4Ever, dolphin25, btfu149 and 1 other person like this. -
I can help arbitrate between LB and 68 to create an appropriate Sig bet between the two said first round picks.
Let's not fumble this opportunity gentlemen...Paul 13 likes this. -
dolphin25 likes this.
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just because he came from a certain school does not mean he can not have a successful career in the NFL. I am fine with taking Parker over Gordon by the way but this whole "when is the last time a player from this university did well in the NFL" logic does not make sense at all lol
When is the last time a quarterback from Cal translated well in the NFL before Rodgers? Purdue before Brees? miami of Ohio before Roethlisberger? Dartmouth before Flacco? university of Pittsburgh before and after Marino?Fin-Omenal, dolphin25, MonstBlitz and 1 other person like this. -
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Purdue has thrown for more TD's and yards than any other college program in NFL history and produced 3 Super Bowl Champions (Dawson, Griese, Brees) which is also a record.Phoenician Fan, Fin4Ever and Vertical Limit like this. -
EverFin, CashInFist, Fin-Omenal and 1 other person like this.
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Fin-Omenal likes this.
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Correlation can be found everywhere, so it isn't exactly worth the dried dog s$$t that you mention. It's worthy of consideration at the least. Basing the entirety of the draft value on the school alone is absurd, I think we can all agree on that though.dolfan22, Pandarilla and btfu149 like this. -
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When's the last time a Jeff Tedford qb did anything in the nfl ...
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While it is true that Gary Pinkel's offensive system (which has remained a steady constant at Missouri, unlike the other places you mention such as USC or Wisconsin) simplifies a tight end's responsibility to a degree that proves to be an extra hurdle for those players learning an NFL system, I did not cite this as a reason Michael Egnew would not succeed at the NFL level. In fact I had Egnew running (albeit a distant) third to Coby Fleener and Dwayne Allen in that draft. If your interpretation of that is me saying Egnew would not succeed in the pros because he's a Missouri tight end, then I think that's a poor interpretation.
Let's call this for what it is. It's lazy evaluation. It's trying to pass off dog sh-t as chocolate pudding. Tying Melvin Gordon together with Ron Dayne, when there are 15 years of separation between the two, completely different coaches, completely different systems, completely different supporting players, etc...is dog sh-t. That's what it is. Dry dog sh-t or wet dog sh-t, I'll leave that up to you. But it's dog sh-t. -
Agreed regarding Gordon (plus he was my first choice leading up to the draft)...but is it going to be a thing that we talk about him in every single thread for the length of his career? I've seen a bunch already and teams haven't even had real practice yet.
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So yeah you could hear Gordon being brought up every time he does something. But 90+ percent of the time, that will just be the one poster doing it over and over again.CashInFist likes this. -
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I'm not going to hold back when I see evaluation of players based exclusively on their school. As you might have noticed, it is a serious pet peeve of mine because for some reason people still give it credence even though it defies logic.
If there was ever a child molester in your town then I get to say you're probably a child molester too. Because, LOGIC!
Weighing a player's system, experience and coaching is completely different. Talking about the experience that Gary Pinkel tight ends have, or the production that they tend to have, has nothing to do with schools or laundry. Even talking about Jeff Tedford quarterbacks has nothing to do with saying Oregon or California quarterbacks never work out. You're talking about the experience those players have relative to the experiences they're going to have, and whether there are any incremental hurdles that result from that translation. That doesn't mean players can't bound over those hurdles easily, as we saw when Aaron Rodgers made a complete EMBARRASSMENT of those claiming that Jeff Tedford quarterbacks can't play in the NFL. But the extra hurdles could be there nonetheless. Just as the system must always be considered when evaluating a player's pure production, with emphasis being placed on efficiency metrics.
And none of any of that has any resemblance to saying that a Wisconsin running back is not going to succeed because of Ron Dayne. Or because of James White, Montee Ball or John Clay. All of those players had talent profiles unique to themselves and they all deserved individual evaluation. Hence Clay was not drafted, White was drafted in the 4th round, and Ball was drafted in the late 2nd round. Lest we start pretending they all got painted with the same awesome brush and drafted in the 1st round simply because they were Wisconsin backs. They weren't.
I will not take pity on someone that falls into that trap because you SHOULD know better.CashInFist and Fin-Omenal like this. -
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The thing about these lazy evaluation techniques is...nobody is claiming you can't have an opinion. But if you're going to have one and you're going to assert it toward someone else in an arguing way intended to convince other people that your opinion is right, don't form that opinion lazily. It's like writing an editorial for the newspaper and then misquoting people, making assumptions that aren't true, stating facts that aren't really facts, misspelling words and writing sentence fragments. Nobody's forcing you to step up to the microphone. But if you are going to come up to the mic, come correct.
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IMO it's the run blocking/play design from last year that goes unappreciated. -
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I don't think they're underrating Lamar Miller, I think they don't like who's behind Lamar Miller. A lot of the teams ranked above us have very good tandems, if a guy like Bernard is taking a play or two off, they have Hill to go in. A lot of teams ranked above us have two capable starters.
The one that stands out to me is the Broncos at 13... they can produce but because of Peyton's passing threat.. defenses are looking to defend the passing game first... I don't think CJ Anderson or Montee Ball are more talented than Miller but they are a tandem so I guess for that reason you put them above us but I don't think there's much difference between the 13th ranked team up to 21 except for the Rams. I'd definitely rank the Rams running backs over the Broncos.. -
If you don't mind, talk about some of the things youre referring to. Maybe that'll open more eyes to how well he's played. -
all begins on the offensive line. hopefully, we can resolve that problem this year.
Fin4Ever likes this. -
I have a very high opinion of C.J. Anderson. He's been a revelation.
As for Lamar Miller my honest opinion was that in the final month of 2014 he really started to come around and do more by himself than he had been doing in the first three quarters of 2014.
I remember during the BALTIMORE game thinking this is one of the first times that I've seen Lamar Miller perform legit well for a tailback and not just produce what the combination of blocking and his speed gives him. He's a physically gifted guy, which always gave him a nice floor as an NFL player. This is why he was a good draft pick. But had we seen him step up and actually be good? In my opinion rarely, but then in that Baltimore game he did just that and kept doing it through the end of the season.
I looked it up and the metrics bear that out. Final four games last year his Elusiveness Rating (post-contact yards per attempt multiplied by broken tackles per attempt) was 52.5, good for 8th out of 35 qualifying backs (qualification set at 10+ attempts per game = 40+ attempts over the four game stretch). The first 12 games his Elusiveness Rating was 23.5, which was 33rd out of 38 qualifying backs (qualification set at 10+ attempts per game = 120+ attempts over the 12 game stretch).
Anyway point being right around that Baltimore game I truly felt like the proverbial light bulb went on for Lamar Miller and I hope he continues that into 2015.
EDIT: Should be noted though, we've seen stretches like that before for Lamar Miller. During a four-week stretch in Weeks 7 through 10 of 2013, he had a nice 60.0 ER on 60 attempts. The other 12 games he had a pitiful 13.0 ER on 143 attempts, making his full year ER a pedestrian 23.3. So we need to actually see him continue looking like the light bulb has come on. -
2) Please tell me where I said McEvoy was a RB, I said players on Wisconsin's roster with at least 30 carries. I was trying to illustrate that Wisconsin players outside of Gordon seemed to able to effectively behind the line you were calling not very good.
3) Lazy evaluation would be simply calling Wisconsin's offensive line not very good (particularly run blocking for this argument) and then not backing it up at all.Pandarilla likes this. -
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