The way I look at it, IF Rosen develops and shows massive improvement, we just got a 10th pick for a 2nd. That would be an amazing situation allowing us to use our top pick this year for the best defensive player out there and dramatically changes our draft strategy.

He’s essentially got a 12 game interview to prove this should be his team. Even if he’s not, I wouldn’t be opposed to not drafting a QB in 2020 with the idea we could be for in a good spot for Lawrence in 2021. Whoever our QB is, they’re gonna need a lot of help around them.

 

Yup, I desperately want Rosen to be the guy since we can trade the Tua pick for 3-4 more early round players...likely landing multiple day one starters from it. If he doesn't get there then we don't lose anything since at worst he would be a SOLID backup for the next decade. But if he does prove that he's the man, then we're really turning the corner quickly with this team.

 

I mean, it's not like Fitz made it a hard choice.

 

If the dolphins try to do a two season tank to get anyone I hope the NFL kicks the dolphins out of the NFL. That would be the stupidest decision ever and no way Flores it anyone in that coaching staff survives something so stupid.

 

Who is talking about a two season tank? If they were to trade their first this year for more next year, that wouldn't indicate tanking again. They have plenty of picks still this year to get plenty of pieces to be competitive, while still retaining plenty of picks for 2021 to get the QB they want.

 

I think that Rosen needs to ruin the tank to prevent us from getting Tua. Honestly, if Rosen can muster up a few wins with this line, all the drops ,try and inconsistent RB play, that says a lot. I would not give up the farm for Tua.

That being said, I would hedge my bet with Rosen. I would try and move back at some point in the draft to acquire another first round pick in order to have 3 first round picks in 2021. By then, we will know everything that we need to know about Rosen. If he isn't the guy, we move heaven and Earth to get Lawrence.

If Tua is on the board when we are drafting, I think we take him. I like the Rivers/Brees and Wentz/Bradford/Daniel model. Let's bring some solid players in, and let it sort itself out. If we drafted Tua, and Rosen balled out in camp and was the guy, so be it. It would not bother me. What would bother me is that if Rosen turned out to be fool's gold after this season. Considering everything around him, it is difficult to get an evaluation that I feel comfortable with. I have been impressed, but I am still curious as to how much better he would be if the team was better.

 

Given Rosen‘s performance in the NFL historically, there aren’t enough games left in the season to convince me that the team shouldn’t draft a quarterback number-one overall in 2020.

The quarterback position is too important in the NFL nowadays to be allowing number-one overall picks to be used on other positions in the absence anything but several years of above-average quarterback play from the one you already have.

 

there was a tweet earlier in this thread since removed?? Said the dolphins were in the process of a two season tank for one of the two quarterbacks this or next year

 

No to lawrence. Tua is a much better QB. We should be shooting for tua next draft.

 

Props to Brian Flores.

 

I agree with starting Rosen.

The chances of a Fitzmagic game is too dangerous for the tank.

 

I know I’m in the minority here, but with all of these draft picks we have, I say we use the to build a powerhouse in the trenches on both sides of the ball...get that foundation SET and if Rosen doesn’t pan out, sell the farm, if need be for Lawrence.

I watched this kid play against Alabama and he is really something special. Clemson wasn’t supposed to beat Alabama and Nick Saban, but he did and did so decisively. If he can come to a good team...like Marino, like Kelly, like Brady, like Roethlisburger, like Rodgers...like all of these great quarterbacks they came to well established teams and if a Lawrence can, he’s going to be a household name.

Alas, in today’s NFL though instead of finding a driver for your race car, teams go find find a driver without even having a car to drive

 

And that's going to be the nature of the beast, unfortunately, because the teams picking high enough in the draft to get the driver (the QB) aren't going to have much of a car to drive, hence their picking so high.

But if you draft only for the "car" and get stronger as a team in that fashion, you'll likely no longer be picking high enough to get an adequate driver (the QB), and there goes your plan.

The Dolphins are doing this exactly the right way by tanking for the first pick and getting the driver, while amassing a ton of other picks so that the car can get drafted right alongside him.

The car doesn't need to be comprised of the first overall pick. It can be had via the later picks the Dolphins have amassed. The driver, however, needs to be the first overall pick.

 

I mean, to be entirely fair often unless it's a generational talent, the first QB taken doesnt seem to pan out any more than guys taken a bit after.

The advantage of #1 is being able to take whoever you want, a great player still has to be available and we still have to pick him.

 

Right, and that's why you don't tank unless a projected elite QB will be available. You might as well wait until another year, when one is.

But you don't tank for trench players at number one overall.

 

I agree, I'm just not sure if Tua is that guy or not. I feel like we basically have to take him if we are tanking. I dont think there is anyone available outside of a QB you can even argue this year has the game changing ability to be taken #1, even if you think the QB class isnt great.

 

We can't be totally sure about anybody, but take a look at the guy's performance. He may be surrounded by great players, but that doesn't explain the entirety of his 225 college passer rating this year. That's too extreme to be attributable entirely to things other than his ability.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/player/stats/_/id/4241479/tua-tagovailoa

 

Umm, he has arguably the best offensive line in college football and two potential 1st round receivers. He'll have multiple plays PER QUARTER where he stands in the pocket for 8+ seconds before throwing. And to top it all off, they haven't played anyone so far this season that could remotely challenge him.

Tua looks excellent in the pocket...but so would Brett Favre in his 50's behind that line and that competition. The only thing we know for a fact is that against strong competition, Tua's passer rating went way down last season. If he chokes again this year then I don't see how we consider him a legit candidate for the #1 overall pick.

 

Banking on being able to “sell the farm to get Trevor Lawrence in 2021 is silly, way too many variables at play. And the idea that Rosen has any shot of convincing this regime to pass on a QB in the 1st round next year is even crazier.

 

Agreed.. Lawrence is struggling this season in comparison to Tua, Fromm, and Herbert... passing on Tua's consistency makes no sense.

Josh Rosen can't even sniff the passing numbers that rookies Minshew, Jones, or Murray are putting up. He's hasn't improved since College. He's the same guy.

Passing on QBs this season while hoping the light comes on is akin to trying to give Tannehill yet another year. There is zero downside to drafting Tua and letting Rosen compete with him. You keep the winner and trade the other.

 

Chokes???

Are you actually watching Tua play, or is this just 'Bama bias?

I get that. I live between Bama and LSU. I hear the BS year round and don't like either team. I was skeptical of Tua last year as a result, but started watching him more closely once we decided to dump this season for a QB for the future... and Josh Rosen that ain't likely to be. He still can't sniff the passing numbers of true rookies this season.

I think a lot of the anxiety with Tua is that he's just so good that he personally makes things look far too easy. I think he'd look good no matter what school he played at... and he has Saban doing what Shula did once Shula got Marino - he completely changed his offensive philosophy to tailor his offense to his QB and they are running an NFL style offense there. Lots of west coast concepts with horizontal routes.

For those who haven't followed Bama, Tua is now in his 3rd offense with Sarkasian as OC this season, and the OL has a new OL Coach this year.

"Against strong competition" all QBs numbers dip. That's a cop out and not specific to Tua. You see that at every level.

In the Georgia game last year, 2018 1st round NFL OLman, Jonah Willams, got pushed back so far so fast that he stomped on Tua's ankle and almost broke it. Tua finished the game hobbled for the next three games. He faced Clemson with those same injuries, then had off-season ankle surgery.

This stuff where people are acting like Bama has an College NFL ALL-PRO OL is simply not true. The starting LG from last year, Deonte Brown, has been suspended since last season's playoffs. He was just able to come back a week or two ago. The only two positions set on Bama's OL are the two tackle spots - the 3 interior positions have all been a rotation among true freshman (Evan Neal) a transfer from FSU (Landon Dickerson) and a handful of inexperienced players (Chris Owens, Emil Ekiyor, etc...). None have played particularly well. The TE’s have blocked so poorly, that they converted an OT (Kendall Randolph) to TE so they could try and get some semblance of competent blocking. Almost sounds like what Gugs has been dealing with here with ther revolving door on the OL.

And regardless, it's not like Tua is the only QB in College with good surrounding cast:
Tua - Decent, but unsettled OL and rushing team this season. Outstanding WRs.
Herbert - The #1 ranked OL in college. Good RBs and WRs. #1 LT prospect.
Fromm - Very good OL, good RBs, and very good WRs.
Lawrence - Better OL than Bama, Outstanding WRs and TEs, one of the best RBs in college.

YMMV.

 

They may as well evaluate what they have with Rosen even if he does not win.At least they will get an idea of what he may be capable of and if not,what does the barber say? NEXT!