[Merged] Dan Henning's playcalling

"Muck wrote:

Ask yourselves this question...

Could we have overcome another turnover today?

Odds are it would have come out of the passing game.

So what exactly is the offense going to do going forward? We have the most vanilla offense in the league and have only scored 20 points in two games offensively. How are we going to compete in the future?

"Muck wrote:

Ask yourselves this question...

Could we have overcome another turnover today?

Odds are it would have come out of the passing game.

We sure aren't taking advantage of the other teams mistakes. We should have iced that game 10 times over, but couldn't. Thank god our D is better than expected or we would be 0-2. Our offense was outscored today, don't forget that.

Some of that is on the offense and just not manning up, but some of that also is the ultra conservative bland playcalling that everyone in the building knew was coming. There's a reason the Vikes were hitting R&R in the backfield so often, they were sending more men than we had blockers because they knew exactly what the play was and were it was going. Nor were they scared or honest defending the pass as we made little attempt beyond the first Marshall play and a mid second quarter Hartline attempt to throw it beyond 10 yards.

Someone said it earlier, this is Wannyball 2.0. We have a QB with a cannon arm, a line that is performing pretty solidly and a top 3 wideout. Use it!

"texanphinatic wrote:

We sure aren't taking advantage of the other teams mistakes. We should have iced that game 10 times over, but couldn't. Thank god our D is better than expected or we would be 0-2. Our offense was outscored today, don't forget that.

Some of that is on the offense and just not manning up, but some of that also is the ultra conservative bland playcalling that everyone in the building knew was coming. There's a reason the Vikes were hitting R&R in the backfield so often, they were sending more men than we had blockers because they knew exactly what the play was and were it was going. Nor were they scared or honest defending the pass as we made little attempt beyond the first Marshall play and a mid second quarter Hartline attempt to throw it beyond 10 yards.

Someone said it earlier, this is Wannyball 2.0. We have a QB with a cannon arm, a line that is performing pretty solidly and a top 3 wideout. Use it!

I think Wannyball was a little more explosive tbh. As of right now, what makes Henne better than Fiedler? Sure he doesn't turn it over as much as Jay did, but then again, Jay threw the ball down the field a lot more (not bombs, but down the field).

If the issue is confidence in our QB, then we're in trouble. If the coaches don't believe Henne can make big throws and choose to run TE screens, little out routes, then we're ****ed in the long run.

I love being 2-0. I love our defense. There's a lot of positive things going on in Miami. However, until the offense comes to life, I'm not as confident in our team going forward. Maybe I'm 'overreacting' (I know someone will say it), but I'm worried. It's not like the defenses we play are going to get easier. Still have the NYJ twice, Pitt, Ravens, etc... coming up.

"Clark Kent wrote:

So what exactly is the offense going to do going forward? We have the most vanilla offense in the league and have only scored 20 points in two games offensively. How are we going to compete in the future?

It has absolutely nothing to do with going up against a damned good defense today right?

I recall you saying that the Dolphins were going to lose the game today and yet they didn't. They scored enough to win, and the defense came thru big time. They ran the ball very well too..

That's what we want. Then try to unleash Henne but establish who you are first, and thats run the ball, control the clock and play great defense.

Is anyone paying attention to Houston @ Washington? The QBs have thrown for over 800 combined yards and both teams are tied up at 27. The Texans had a scoring drive of 8 plays, 81 yards in 1:13.

One minute and thirteen freaking seconds.

Henne had a good day, albeit low key, but looking at performances like Schaub and McNabb tells me that something is still wrong with our offense. Maybe it really is time for Henning to go. We have an early bye week this year...

"Ozzy wrote:

It has absolutely nothing to do with going up against a damned good defense today right?

I recall you saying that the Dolphins were going to lose the game today and yet they didn't. They scored enough to win, and the defense came thru big time. They ran the ball very well too..

That's what we want. Then try to unleash Henne but establish who you are first, and thats run the ball, control the clock and play great defense.

No, it really doesn't. We didn't do any better against a garbage defense in the Bills last week, and we aren't suddenly going to see a line of Saint Louis Rams ahead of us. No, we have the likes of the Jets twice, the Ravens, Steelers, Packers, etc. We have to put more than 7 offensive points on the board, even against good Ds. You say we scored enough to win, but offensively, no, we didn't.

"Ozzy wrote:

It has absolutely nothing to do with going up against a damned good defense today right?

I recall you saying that the Dolphins were going to lose the game today and yet they didn't. They scored enough to win, and the defense came thru big time. They ran the ball very well too..

That's what we want. Then try to unleash Henne but establish who you are first, and thats run the ball, control the clock and play great defense.

EDIT: Wasn't me.

"texanphinatic wrote:

No, it really doesn't. We didn't do any better against a garbage defense in the Bills last week, and we aren't suddenly going to see a line of Saint Louis Rams ahead of us. No, we have the likes of the Jets twice, the Ravens, Steelers, Packers, etc. We have to put more than 7 offensive points on the board, even against good Ds. You say we scored enough to win, but offensively, no, we didn't.

That garbage defense last week was a divison foe, of whom, Miami had not beat in their house in 5 years. They have one of the better pass defenses in the league.

"jaxdolfan wrote:

Ricky should spell Ronnie or play only if he is the hot hand.

Otherwise Ronnie should start. No more of his rotating series crapola.

Why not continue rotating? Have you ever played organized football before besides Madden? That 1-2 punch with Ronnie/Ricky, believe or not, keeps the defense on their heels because of their somewhat different style of running....

"Clark Kent wrote:

I said what? When? Go find me a quote where I said Miami was going to lose. Get back to me with "My bad, it wasn't you, it was someone else."

My appologies to you sir.

I got you (Clark Kent) messed up with someone else (Cpt JT Kirk)

"Ozzy wrote:

That garbage defense last week was a divison foe, of whom, Miami had not beat in their house in 5 years. They have one of the better pass defenses in the league.

The Packers agree with this ... oh wait.

I'm not complaining that we won, but its disconcerting to see the offense putting up jack. Ill take a TD and a few field goals even, but we didn't even get those today. We were handed multiple chances to ice the game and couldn't get it done. It should never have come down to a 4th down goal line stand.

But my point is you can't play the "up against a good defense" card when you are consistently going up against top defenses. What happens when some team gets ahead of us? What happens when our special teams let up, or a TO gets taken in for a TD? What happens when our D slips? Can the offense step it up and get it done? Let alone just put a game away. We haven't seen the ability to do that yet this year.

"texanphinatic wrote:

The Packers agree with this ... oh wait.

I'm not complaining that we won, but its disconcerting to see the offense putting up jack. Ill take a TD and a few field goals even, but we didn't even get those today. We were handed multiple chances to ice the game and couldn't get it done. It should never have come down to a 4th down goal line stand.

But my point is you can't play the "up against a good defense" card when you are consistently going up against top defenses. What happens when some team gets ahead of us? What happens when our special teams let up, or a TO gets taken in for a TD? What happens when our D slips? Can the offense step it up and get it done? Let alone just put a game away. We haven't seen the ability to do that yet this year.

But I never said our offense was great right? I was just saying. That was a division game on the road and thats not an easy task ...

"Coral Reefer wrote:

The debate over whether it's Henning calling a crap game or if he's calling vanilla and conservative plays because Henne simply cannot make the proper reads and decisions under pressure is going to be a long standing debate this year I'm afraid.

It could be either one or .... god forbid.... both.

I saw a couple specific replays that really call Henne's ability to make time sensitive decisions during plays where he has a WR early.

Did you see that first play of the game, or did you see the other throws in tight coverage that were right on target for Henne? How can you say it's Henne?

"Desides wrote:

Is anyone paying attention to Houston @ Washington? The QBs have thrown for over 800 combined yards and both teams are tied up at 27. The Texans had a scoring drive of 8 plays, 81 yards in 1:13.

One minute and thirteen freaking seconds.

Henne had a good day, albeit low key, but looking at performances like Schaub and McNabb tells me that something is still wrong with our offense. Maybe it really is time for Henning to go. We have an early bye week this year...

do we get matt schaub with the new off coordinator?

**** it, fire Henning.

"Ozzy wrote:

But I never said our offense was great right? I was just saying. That was a division game on the road and thats not an easy task ...

Indeed not - Im not trying to rag on you man, its all good. :hi5:

I just think we need to open it up more, and Henning seems very reluctant. You don't get to be a great offense by predictable and pedestrian play calling. :up:

I think we also still need more explosive players as well. A new TE and RB wouldn't be out of place - I can't help but think someone like like AP or CJ2k would have broken that run Ronnie had all the way.

God's but our D is playing lights out though, so few weaknesses so far, and who the hell would have predicted that.

You guys have to realize that there's 16 games in a season, and playcalling goes well past the actual down the teams are dealing with on the field. Coordinators for both teams are studying film as we speak and preparing for next week...watching every little juke and stutter step looking for something to exploit.

What I saw today was the Jets and the Pats throw down a heck of a fight; that film will be invaluable to us over the next two weeks. You watch Miami's game film and you'll say, "Well, on paper they look tough...but we've yet to see it on the field."

Henning is pacing himself, intentionally playing conservative, and that will end in seven days once NY comes to Miami. I'm not a big Henning fan either, but for now he's 100% doing his job and burning the clock when we have a lead.

"adamprez2003 wrote:

do we get matt schaub with the new off coordinator?

It’s worth noting that McNabb’s OC this year was Schaub’s last year.

"Desides wrote:

It’s worth noting that McNabb’s OC this year was Schaub’s last year.

didnt realize that. good nugget of info

"phinnhedd wrote:

Did you see that first play of the game, or did you see the other throws in tight coverage that were right on target for Henne? How can you say it's Henne?

His ability to go through progression doesn't seem as up to snuff

"SICK wrote:

marshall will get pissed soon. and rightfully so.

By looking at some of his facial reactions I would say he already has.

"Clark Kent wrote:

So what exactly is the offense going to do going forward? We have the most vanilla offense in the league and have only scored 20 points in two games offensively. How are we going to compete in the future?

All I'm saying is to give it a chance going forward. Rarely do you have a finished product in Week 1.

We looked much better this week from a timing and cohesion standpoint. Last week we dropped passes and struggled to go forward on running downs. We played great on D but dropped INT's, couldn't force turnovers.

Today we hit on a bomb early. Henne was accurate. The receivers caught the ball well. We gashed the league's #1 rush defense and did a very good job keeping that vaunted front four away from our QB. And we hauled in FOUR INT's (one negated) and scored a defensive TD.

It wasn't always pretty today. But we saw improvement against better competition on the road. Let's see what happens when we finally play at home and aren't pinned to our goal line. :)

"texanphinatic wrote:

We sure aren't taking advantage of the other teams mistakes. We should have iced that game 10 times over, but couldn't. Thank god our D is better than expected or we would be 0-2. Our offense was outscored today, don't forget that.

Some of that is on the offense and just not manning up, but some of that also is the ultra conservative bland playcalling that everyone in the building knew was coming. There's a reason the Vikes were hitting R&R in the backfield so often, they were sending more men than we had blockers because they knew exactly what the play was and were it was going. Nor were they scared or honest defending the pass as we made little attempt beyond the first Marshall play and a mid second quarter Hartline attempt to throw it beyond 10 yards.

Someone said it earlier, this is Wannyball 2.0. We have a QB with a cannon arm, a line that is performing pretty solidly and a top 3 wideout. Use it!

I think we all agree that Dan leaves something to be desired at times. But today wasn't your typical football game.

Look at what we did in the first half. Bomb to Marshall. Nice throws to Hartline. 90 yards rushing, including a long run by Brown from our 1 yard line. We saw a new Wildcat formation repeatedly work against the league's best run defense. We pinned Minnesota back when we punted. 7-0 and we're dominating in the dome playing OUR game.

Now look at the second half.

Drive 1: 41 yards, fizzles at MIN 39.

-- We pin them inside the 5 yard line. Defense takes it away for a touchdown. Miami leads 14-0
-- Defense takes it away again, but we start on the 1.

Drive 2: From our 1 yard line, Ricky fumbles.

-- MIN scores TD from the 2. Miami leads 14-7

Drive 3: John Jerry gets flagged for holding, putting us in a hole. Drive dies at MIA 45.

-- MIN starts at the 11 yard line. We hold them to a field goal. Miami leads 14-10

4TH QUARTER

Drive 4: 7:52 left. 3-and-out. Deeper pass falls incomplete.

-- Jason Allen INT of Favre

Drive 5: 5:58 left. First play, Ronnie fumbles on our 24 yard line.

-- Dolphins stuff Adrian Peterson at the 1 yard line.

Drive 6: 1 yard line. 2:16 left. MIN has all three TO's and the 2-min warning. Drive dies at the 14.

Drive 7: Kneel down.

We just didn't have a lot of opportunities to be aggressive in the second half.

You guys really have me tired complaining and complaining about Henning's playcalling

You guys really have me tired complaining and complaining about Henning's playcalling. The only call I had a problem with was when it was 2nd and 3rd and 20, and he decided to run it. But that may have even been the right play-call.

But why are you guys complaining about Henne's lack of attempts? We're winning 14-0, we're controlling the running game (Thanks to HENNING'S decision to throw deep on the 1st play of the game. Why would we pass deep if at all and risk an interception that can change the game. We had silly tournovers running the ball, but how is that Henning's fault? I think we're doing a fine job on all aspects of the game. From coaching to offense to defense.

I don't know how you guys can't be happy after starting the season 2-0, with 2 wins on the road. One against a division rival in a place we hadn't won in like 7 years, and the other against a team that made the NFC Championship game also on the road, in a place they hadn't lost in 2 years, despite playing amazing teams.

So chilax, trust the coaches, since they're doing a fine job, and enjoy the W's

dolfan94, you make some good points, but despite the wins, I think most 'Phins fans know that if it wasn't for Henning's conservative play-calling Miami might have won both of these games going away, rather than having both games nearly give fans of the boys from South Beach heart attacks.

It's absolutely glorious that our defense stood up like it did during these games, and without Henning's ultra-conservative style of play, that probably wouldn't have even been explored, but truthfully, I think most 'Phins fans would gladly do without all the testing of the defense. It's showed its mettle, now let's reward it by having it on the field as little as possible to stay fresh.

In other words, Dan Henning, throw the ball down the damn field more often...lol

Well when your defense is winded in the 4th quarter and you go 3 and out, theres a problem that exists. You need to be able to pick up some critical first downs. Tonight we didn't come up with those, but we did end up with the W. If we want to be a playoff and superbowl contender, our offense needs to step it up and that start right at the top with the offensive coordinator.

His playcalling was atrocius and it has been for quite some time. Put your playmakers in position to make plays. Minus the first play of the game where we hit Brandon Marshall long, there really isn't much more to talk about. We stuck to conservative playcalling after that, which resulted in how many first downs tonight? How many drives where we could say we put some points on the board where we had those opportunities? I don't know many teams that go far putting less than 15 points on the board consistently. The playcalling is atrocious and we need to open it up. We can't always rely on our defense to win us the game all the time. If we do, we'll not be very successful.

Playcalling is our biggest weakness. Use your strengths. Yeah we have good running backs, but we're using Ricky more than Ronnie, we're not utilizing our TE's, Brandon Marshall is a game changer and we're using him very conservatively. What would make you happy? Just run run run run run? Yeah that just doesn't work.

We need to keep defenses honest. Being able to open up the offense allows the run game to prosper and vice versa. We didn't spend the money on Marshall to use him as an expensive distraction.