A version of this question was brought up by RNI in the POFO in a thread about weed. I'd love the opportunity to discuss this idea respectfully of course.
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How so laces out?
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Hasn't really helped Tim Tebow's passer rating...
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With one God, there is a need for him to be good and flawless.
If there is many Gods it doesn't matter if one or almost all of them are huge jerks. -
Well, what about Titans? -
shula_guy Well-Known Member
So the question is what, Does god need to be good?
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If this is about weed I will say that many christians would disagree with me. I think everything natural has a purpose and in Genesis 1 God says that he gives man all seed bearing plants on the whole face of the earth and that everything he has made is good. That's my stance. I see nothing wrong with weed, its not addictive and its here for a reason.
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
What purpose does free will have? -
I think Fin D is on the right track in this confusing thread. Now I know what inspired this thread from what I said in POFO when I suggested maybe if someone had a relationship with God they wouldn't be psychopathic killers and child molesters. I was defending God to someone that didn't believe in God and he suggested that my God made psychopathic killers and child molesters which I found absurd.
I went on to explain that people had free will and God didn't make psychpathic killers and child molesters. That was their choice.
But no I don't think anyone needs God to be good. I will add that being good won't bring anyone to heaven according to the bible. -
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There is plenty of good people that do good things in this world that don't have a relationship with God. IMO people like that should be repected because I believe we are all "bent toward sin" and have evil desires in our hearts.
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
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By the way, thanks for making this thread. I prefer my POFO threads to stay on topic which is almost impossible unless people do what you just did here. I appreciate it.
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"To be good all of the time (while) around so many who are not good is an action that will ruin you"
God, being "good" is based on mere human perception, keep in mind when the Eternal is viewed, instead of the individual's narrow world/time view, good or bad is simply a state of mind. -
Ohiophinphan Chaplain Staff Member Luxury Box
I guess I am still not sure what the question is in this thread. Is humanity inherantly good? No, we are inherantly sinful, that is we choose self over others. Can people do good things without the obvious, direct inflence of God? Obviously yes. That answer comes from human observation. Though if we are indeed "created in the image of God" then perhaps the question is moot because God is somehow imprinted into our DNA whether we relate to it or not.
Am I good? No, I am a sinner at the same time I am a redeemed saint. Both, always.
Am I on the target? -
God and good are the same thing.
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
I think if one person asks another person to hold 10k for them while they go help their kid out. I think if that 10k was a lot of money to that person holding it, they would steal it because they need it. However if the person had bill gates type of money they would generaly help the other guy out by keeping his money safe. In general I think one of the basic characteristics people have is that they are charitable to one another. If you see someone with their hands full most people hold the door open for that person. Granted its a very minor thing but it indicates to me given the choice without consequence people generally choose to be good.
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Righteous and "Good" are different things. -
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
You have struck one of my favorite intelectual excercises.
Is selfish bad?
I just posted how I think people are inherently good. The reason why I believe they are is because being good to others makes the person feel good themselves. So the motive to be good becomes a selfish one.
I hope I do not offend anyone with the next part. I typicaly like to use mother teressa as an example of what I mean. She was considered a very selfless person for all her generous charitable work. If you think about it I think its fair to assume she felt very gratified and that her work was spiritual rewarding. She also may of been motivated by thinking it was what God wanted her to do and it was her path to get into Heaven. Im not saying these are bad reasons or she is an evil person but I would argue her motivations are selfish.
My point is that I do not view being selfish as bad. The desire to harm is bad but everything that is selfish isnt motivated by that desire to hurt. -
shula_guy Well-Known Member
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But to answer your question, there is definitely a difference from righteousness and good. -
shula_guy Well-Known Member
I think spmethingelse worth mentioning is that good is a subjective term. Kind of like defining art
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Shulaguy, I think an example of people being what i call "bent toward sin" and having evil desires can be seen by observing little kids play with toys. lol. They always get upset when someone plays with their toys, they aren't inclined to share, and they often hit one another. know what I mean?
But they can be raised to be good kids and good people without ever having a relationship with God. -
Gosh, that seems to be unethical..nah, course not, redistributing rewards for political game is NOT a power game..:rolleyes: -
Ohiophinphan Chaplain Staff Member Luxury Box
Of course none of that really answers your "Is everything . everyone does selfish"? question. I'm gonna duck that one because we Christians use the sense of selfishness as the root of original sin and talk about it in different ways.shula_guy likes this. -
shula_guy Well-Known Member
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
Ohiophinphan likes this. -
I'm just beginning to define God to myself... For now I see it this way.
Good is an idea from a persons individual ego standpoint... My own idea of what 'should' and 'shouldn't' be.
But that's above my spiritual pay grade to decide.
God sees the bigger picture. We must accept what comes our way and find the good in it, and make good of it. Even evil can beget good.padre31 likes this. -
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shula_guy Well-Known Member
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I will share the same disclaimer I shared in my first thread in this religion forum.
I currently don't have a relationship with God, so forgive me if you ever see me in another forum talking about God but also not acting like a christian. I always feel a need to defend God in other threads when I see certain comments people make. I am very knowledgable about the bible to the point where I know most greek and hebrew definitions of english words in the bible. I actually am a reverend but I don't even go to church anymore. I went through a divorce, became bitter and sort of fell away from God.
I just wanted everyone to know that because I do have a tendacy to talk about God and the bible when certain things are brought up in the POFO forum. And I realize that I do that in several posts and I also get into some heated conversations and say things I shouldn't say. But like I was trying to say, I wouldn't even define myself as a christian for the time being. I hope to change that soon.
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