It feels good to see actual draft picks pan out to be special players does it not?

We haven't had much of that over the last decade.
We need more but this is a nice start.

 

Well Ireland seems to do a good job with first round OL players. Its the later rounds where he falls.

 

how many high pick o lineman bust not being sarcastic asking honestly because both were picked pretty high

 

Pouncey gon' Pounce.

 

Well, when you draft a center in the top 15, he'd better be special.

 

.... along with the rest of the league, hence why there are significantly more 1st & 2nd round starting linemen.

 

So passing on Ryan Mallett was a good idea after all? Hmmmm.

 

I've never seen such bitterness from a group of fans because the pick turned out awesome.

There are literally fans who want us to believe the picks for Long & Pouncey were not wins.

 

Ah, but this was the highest selected center of all time, so there's no way it can be a good pick.

 

I get what you're saying. I don't disagree with it either. Both whys are highly productive players. That being saI'd, Jake Long doesn't score touchdowns. The amount If money invested in him (long term No less) isn't justified IMO. I don't think left tackles hold the same value in today's NFL. Yes protecting the qb is important, but playmakers at skill positions are more so. I would gladly trade long for Gronk and herandez. Give me 170 catches, 2000 yards, and 24 touchdowns for the same cost as a top 3 left tackle all day, everyday. The value simply isn't the same, even If Jake is the best LT in football. However, that's different than wanting him to fail or pretending he's a waste.

 

Such a luxury to have a young, future elite center like Pouncey to help bring along Tannehill. Also having one of the best Tackles in the game protecting his blind side, just hope we sure up the right side with the rook and I think we'll be fine up front.

 

I understand but would that LT saving a sack or potential fumble and letting the QB stay in the pocket long enough to complete a pass into the endzone be considered scoring a TD?

 

Yes, it helps. That being said, the drop off from elite to good at that position isn't enough to seriously impact the offense in a detrimental fashion. Theres just not enough game defining or game changing oppertunities to distinguish elite from good/solid for the position. The two best left tackles in the nfl play for two terrible franchises not doing anything worth noting (us and the brownies). As where there is a huge drop off from elite and good in the skill positions. Greg Jennings doesn't impact a game lime Calvin Johnson does. Obviously one has a better team than the other, but all being equal, the differece is gaping.

Edit: to be clear "he doesn't score touchdowns " is a reference to playmaking ability, not just specifically tds.

 

gotcha :up:... who do you think we should of drafted though? i don't even think a WR was drafted in the 1st round that year.

 

Long Pounce and
Big Rich are a nice OL Triumverate.

They need a 4th stout blocker though. You can over come 1 fissure through chips and schemes but not 2.

 

It has to been one of the safest picks anyone could ever make at that point in the draft. His identical twin was named 2nd team All Pro the season before as a rookie. It would have been much more unusual for the 2nd twin to turn out appreciably different since they share the exact same DNA. It's nice that Ireland didn't screw things up and take a more risky player, but heck a blind squirrel could have made the Pouncey pick.

 

Wrong.

 

..... yet many fans wanted Ingram instead, thinking he'd do a better job of transforming our offense.
but Pouncey is proving to be the best pick.... and a blind squirrel would at least need a pair of balls to make that pick at #15. :tongue2:

 

Don't you know by now? Ireland gets no credit for the good picks, and all the blame for the bad ones. That's how it works around here.

More evidence that people need their scapegoat.

 

That limits the bust factor, but it doesn't make the pick a no-brainer. Maurkice Pouncey really isn't all that good of a player, either.

 

The article didn't mention this but I think Pouncey has improved the accuracy of his shot gun snaps. Last season we saw a lot of high snaps but so far this season he has been much more accurate.

 

We should all be VERY grateful that we have him.

 

Pouncey flip!

 

I wanted Mallett and while Im not sure I was incorrect about Mallett being a good pro QB, I do know I was wrong for not wanting Pouncey. I still dont like JI but he made a fine pick there.

 

And if you take that kind of flexible thinking and use it to fuel a systematic investigation across many GMs and their draft picks, I suspect you'll find that Jeff Ireland isn't significantly worse than any other, and that the "good" GMs are the ones who have had franchise QBs.

 

Not carrying the ball into the endzone doesn't mean they "don't score tds"

 

If Jeff Ireland didn't think that Maurkice Pouncey was a good player after his rookie season and would continue to be a very good player throughout his career, then he wouldn't have drafted Mike at #15 a year later. Wouldn't you agree with that?

 

IMO there are certain things Ireland does well...he can figure out OL at the top of a draft. He can generally find DL talent. He can find possession wr's. Everything else.....is what makes people want him gone.

The good GM's are the ones who can find their franchise QB and then put talent around him. Its the putting talent around him part Im having trouble believing Jeff Ireland can handle. And if we have a top 5 pick, which I suspect we will, to go along with 5 picks in what will likely be the first 70 picks of the draft and 50+million in cap space, well those are things I just dont have confidence Jeff Ireland can handle. If we were a better team I might be a little more lenient in my approach but next offseason is just way too important for him to botch up.

I dont really have a problem admitting when I am wrong or short-sighted as I was with Pouncey. I do have a problem calling Ireland a good GM. I dont think hes the worst GM but hell even Matt Millen found a Calvin Johnson.

 

This backlash about taking an OL is all about those who like what Ireland has done/is doing and those who don't... We all know that Buckeye is a stout anti-Irish guy and that prompted his comment... So, the topic on this thread has gone from one of the bright young stars in the league to talking about whether or not Ireland is doing a good job...

I'll stick to bashing him for the moves he doesn't make well instead of the ones he does well in...

 

We are still having discussions about the quality of the Jake Long pick?

Huh, I thought it was 2012...

 

Apparently all the football writers who elected him 2nd Team All Pro as a rookie, and 1st Team All Pro last season, are just blind fools who voted for him based on reputation?

 

For the most part, yes. Maurkice Pouncey is a pretty average player on a woeful line, and he plays for one of the couple fan-bases where you've basically got to have name recognition to get elevated to accolades. Same thing happens to New England, Dallas, etc. players.

 

IF, Ireland did not think Maurkice was a good player after his rookie season, he'd have been part of a small minority within the ranks of NFL personnel men, and one would really have good cause to doubt his sanity. You got the chance to draft a player with the exact same DNA as a guy who got elected 2nd Team All Pro as a rookie, IMO, (especially considering it's been a need position since Tim Ruddy retired), It's a no brainer, and you do it.

 

Fans do not vote for the All Pro team. He was elected 1st team by the PFWA last season, as voted on by their 300 plus members throughout the USA
He was voted 1st team All Pro by Associated Press, which is a national panel of 50 NFL writers.
IMO, it is ludicrous to suggest he got voted in based on rep when he hasn't been around long enough to establish a rep among NFL writers to the point they'd just vote for him on name familiarity over a guy like Nick Mangold for example.

 

Voting Maurkice Pouncey over Nick Mangold is pretty scandalously bad, and I'm not sure just random fan voting isn't preferable to an organization that has Peter King as a valued member.