send em a 3rd and make it happen. bring boldin home to south fla.

 

I believe they wanted a 1st and a 3rd this past off-season. That's not happening, I don't see it with this management. If they will take a second, then I'd be OK with it. I like Anquan but he's been really banged up lately.

 

:eek: Holy ****!!!

 

Boldin is like one big walking injury. Not sure if he is worth more than a 4th in this coming draft.

 

:yes:
Tell us EXACTLY how you feel Travis.
Unfortunately, even with Boldin, I think we still need an Alpha type reciever at this juncture in his career.

 

Boldin is a WR I least want. He gets hurt alot and look at what he is doing right now in Arizona. I would rather trade for Brandon Marshall after the year


Yeah cause he really cost us the game v.s. the Jets. Ted Ginn is what he is and thats a deep threat who needs parts around him.

 

hahaha yea right

 

Wow, that's a substantive post right there.

Well, I'm sure he can get us 2 KR touchdowns every 2 1/2 years or so.

If not, someone will.

Anyone.

 

It is certainly equal to the post it was responding to... he's bashing Ginn, no surprise you felt compelled to come to the rescue.

 

That's not true at all, otherwise more than 109 players would have 2 or more KRs for TDs over their careers.

Knock the guy all you want, but at least have a shred of truth mixed in.

The #1 kick returner of all time (in yardage and returns), Brian Mitchell never had more than 1 KR for a TD in a season, and over any 3 year span in his career never had more than 2 KRs for TDs.

I would guess less than 35 guys have more than 2 TDs over any 3 year span. And even less if you only count the modern era.

 

Keep Ginn for returns and limited WR work only.

Boldin prob wins us the games that Ginn "lost" though.


I wouldn't put those losses all on Ginn, but I'll say that Boldin would of won a few.

Boldin's trade value definitely went down this season so I could actually see our FO considering it. As far as Ginn's value, I'd throw him to AZ if they agreed to stop tagging Karlos Dansby.

 

Hey I was wrong. 38 guys in the ENTIRE history of the NFL have more TDs over a 3 year span than Ted Ginn does (after 2 and a half years).

Spoiler

Travis Williams – Didn’t play in the modern era. Had 4 KRs for a TD his first year, never more than 1 any other.
Gale Sayers – Didn’t return a KO in the modern era, let alone a TD.
Ollie Matson – Didn’t play in modern era.
Dante Hall
Mel Gray
Josh Cribbs
Timmy Brown – Not in modern era.
Michael Bates
Terrence McGee
Justin Miller
Bobby Mitchell – Not in modern era.
Abe Woodson – Not modern era
Ron Brown
Andre Coleman
Cecil Turner
Leon Washington
Jon Vaughn
Darrick Vaughn
Tamarick Vanover
Tony Horne
Devin Hester
Andre Davis
Ronney Jenkins
Tyrone Hughes
Ellis Hobbs
Dave Hampton
Dennis Gentry
Raymond Clayborn
Lynn Chandnois – not modern era
Michael Lewis
Lenny Lyles – not modern era
Jerome Mathis
Derrick Witherspoon
Charley Warner
Vitamin Smith – not modern era
Deion Sanders
Chad Morton
Mercury Morris

38 players, 29 in the modern era.

And guess what, if Ginn gets one more return TD in the next two and a half years he can become #39.

But surely anyone can do what he's done in the past 2 and half years for us, that's why it happens so often for every team in the NFL. :rolleyes:

 

No thanks. A 2nd for a 29 year old WR who's been injured a lot the last 2 seasons, and wants a new, expensive contract? I'd give a 4th maybe. And that's only if we can't land Vincent Jackson, Brandon Marshall, Braylon Edwards, Antonio Bryant, or Steve Breaston first.

 

I wish I was surprised that this turned into a Ginn hate thread.

Travis, how quickly you dismiss the games Ginn has won for us. You weren't this hard on your boy Chambers. Didn't you cry when he was traded?

 

I have to agree, Ginn had a good game last year vs. Buffalo and hauled in 1 TD bomb against New York this year, but other than that, he hasn't done nothing for us.

In 2 1/2 seasons, he's had 1 good game (2008 Buffalo) and that's it. He's just a bad WR.

Chambers had his drops, but he made a ton of plays to make up for it. Right now Chambers is like Jerry Rice to us compared to the load of crap we have right now.

 

Your still my friend:up:

 

Boldin's current deal is 4 years for $22 so that's about $5.5 mill a year. He has next year on it and then he's a FA. What if we just made him play through next year on his current deal then tag him?

Is that really that bad? I think once he heals up for awhile, he's good to go.

 

That's funny, because we're 1-7 without him right now. Sounds like he's done nothing, huh?

 

C'mon, folks. Ginn has done NOTHING?.......
It's fair to say he's been a disappointment; or that he hasn't lived up to what we expected from him. I even think it's fair to say that he's primarily responsible for a couple of losses.
But he's also primarily responsible for that last win against the Jets. And he had a hand in the earlier win as well. Can't we at least maintain some perspective and honesty when talking about him?
Besides the thread was about whether or not Boldin is someone we would like to see down here.
Like alen said, last year, apparently AZ wanted a king's ransom for Boldin. But he's a complainer and he is oft injured.
If AZ really wants to get rid of him they'll listen to realistic offers this time.
I would like to see him down here, but not if we're giving up multiple high picks for him.
Also a few random facts about Chris Chambers:
He DID NOT catch 65 passes for us every single year.
From 01 to 06 - 48; 52; 64; 69; 82; 59.
In 02 he had 734 yd rcv
In 06 he had 677 yd rcv
He only got to 1000 yds one time as a Dolphin - 05.
He caught a total of 43 TD passes as a Dolphin.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/C/ChamCh00.htm

 

Yeah, and if Camarillo started the first Jets game, he never gets behind the entire Jets secondary and we probably lose that game. Coulda, shoulda, woulda, if.

Sorry you missed both Jets games this year. They were really something.

 

I'm sorry, when you say a player has done "zip, zilch, nada, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING" I didn't know that only receiving TDs count as "something".

Ok. So any receiving TD set up by the run game is also nothing? And if it was a great throw by a QB, it's also nothing? I'm learning a lot here.

And how many TDs does Camarillo have this year? Let me see if I have this all straight. Special team TDs = nothing. TDs set up by the run game = nothing. TDs that were great throws by the QB = nothing. Catches on 3rd down = something. Ok. Think I got it.

I love Camarillo. And I acknowledge Ted Ginn needs to make the big catches and develop some consistency. I also acknowledge he's not the #1 WR we drafted him to be. But I think it's plain to see that you saying Ted Ginn has done nothing is an absolutely ridiculous statement and you do a disservice to yourself by making such claims.

 

I would try and offer a reply, but I know I'll just be called an apologist so why bother.

 

Slow down a bit, brother. You're among friends here.
No one here is trying to say they're satisfied with Ginn's contribution. I believe we can all agree that he's fallen well short of expectations.
However, some of us are objecting to the hyperbole you're using to voice your own displeasure.
Asking for you (or anyone) to give credit where it's due shouldn't label someone an "apologist", anymore than using exaggeration to make your point should label you a liar.
Responses are aimed at disputing these untrue statements made by you:

1."If Greg Camarillo is starting for Ginn in the Indianapolis and New Orleans game, we're 5-3 right now,"
2."Is it bashing when the player is awful, drops everything you throw to him and is not condusive to winning at all?"
3."Chambers had 800-1000 yards and more than 60 catches every single year. He also caught 45 touchdowns with us.

Chambers has produced in the NFL.

Ginn has done zip, zilch, nada. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!"

Aside from stating that Chambers has produced in the NFL none of those are true.

 

I don't think anybody on this board would dispute Ted Ginn's shortcomings. But you are making inaccurate statements about Ginn and completely ignoring the positive things he has done for this team.

 

Bottom line is that his play has led him here.......

 

They made him move to Canada?

 

The feeling was the wider field would help keep him in bounds...

 

I know you dislike Ginn an extreme amount but I would say that he's had more than a single quality. As much as people dislike the conclusion of the Miami-Indianapolis game, Ginn had a good game there IMO. Also, if I remember correctly (and correct me if I'm wrong please), Ginn played well against New England last year in the second game and had a quality game against Cincinnati his rookie year - the game when Parcells was watching with Ron Wolf and Beck was quarterbacking IIRC. Didn't he have a pretty good game against the Jets last year to close out the regular season?

 

We've routinely started drives past the 20 since he has taken over return duties. Ignoring his two 2TDs, he'd still be averaging 24.06 yards per return which would put him at 18th in the league (he is currently first with 32.6), of course he would be higher than that if you took away everyone elses two longest returns as well. He has been providing quality returns (and subsequently averages and starting position) this year when given the opportunity. So yea, you're wrong.

 

:up:..good one

 

I don't hate the kid as much as most people think I do, I just think he is a very bad WR. I'm okay with him being a #3, but that's about all he'll ever be. He might succeed if he has a #1 and a #2 besides him. He does have blazing speed, but that doesn't mean he can play the WR postion. Remember Randal Hill??

Other players that have been good KO players or ST players that are just average at best at the WR postion, Hester, Desmond Howard, even Deion Sanders was a good KR, but he sucked at the WR postion.

At this time, I just don't see what he brings to the table other than speed.

 

And Cobbs never proved that he was actually better, remember?

And his drops in clutch moments have only happened this year, remember?

And he's made more plays and scored more TDs than any other WR on this team (even combined), remember?

He's been the #3 or #4 non-kicking pts scorer for this team (a running team) each year he's been here, remember?

No it doesn't fit the BS argument that he's done nothing and drops everything so it's being ignored. No, the fault in logic can't be seen, perhaps because the **** being spewed is above the eyebrows.

 

Honestly, I have no clue who Randal Hill is. I don't know if he's a nineties player but I didn't watch football back then.

Deion Sanders sucked at WR because he was naturally a CB.

 

As Stitches implied, that doesn't mean it was the right decision. Just like having Bess on punt returns (IMO).

 

We drafted Randal "the thrill" Hill way back in 1991 iirc. I am certain we traded him to Arizona, and I think we even got a first rounder for him.

I know he eventually wound up back on our team (1994 maybe?), but he never proved to be worth the 1st rounder that either team used on him.

 

My problem with Ginn is simple, he is too soft, way way too much soft in his game.

As much as we run the ball we need wr who can at least block a little bit, Ginn cannot, will not and more than likely never will while he is in Miami.

Take Ginn for the #3/4 Wr/great kick returner that he is and don't ask him to do very much and he will make me happy.

 

Saying that we lose the Jets game if Ginn's not playing is the same as saying we lose the same game if Camarillo's not playing because of those 2 huge 3rd down grabs.

I've always hated those arguments because it doesn't take into account the major variable, which is what his replacement would've done had he been playing the whole game.

 

Just great then we could have an injury prone WR to go with our injury prone RB.

I wouldn't give up a dam thing for Boldin.

 

This fan base ruined Ted Ginn, Jr. from the get go. Didn't even give him a chance.

I am a firm believer of this. You guys are terrible. Boo'ing the guy when his name is announced with the starters before the games even start. Pathetic.

No wonder his confidence (which is all he's REALLY lacking) is shot. I feel for him.