I saw the video on ESPN. All I can say is, Shaq....don't quit your day job. I've seen white people rap better.

 

(coming from a Kobe supporter/Shaq hater)

If Kobe takes offense to this then he's a ***** for real, excuse the language. Fire back with a friendly counter freestyle, or shake on it.........

I can't believe the media is making a story out of this.

 

It is hilarious that Shaq admits to cheating on his wife in a song, yet somehow it is Kobe's fault for half of his stuff going bye bye?

Silly Shaq, you will never learn will you. The media may think you are this wonderful, fun loving guy, but as for me, I am not buying it. You are probably the most selfish person in the history of profesional sports and it keeps manifesting itself over and over again. For someone who supposedly thinks he is better than Kareem, why is it that teams can't wait to get rid of him? What is he on, his FOURTH team now? Something tells me he is gonna hit a fifth before his career officially ends.

I hope he has a good accountant because half of his money and assets are going away, not to mention the child support he will have to pay. And considering how "good" his rapping and acting is, he isn't gonna have much to fall back on after his diminishing basketball skills completely turn to dust.

Welcome to Desperationville Shaq, just one town away from Obscurity City.

As for Kobe, I really don't think he cares that much, at least not that he will show publicly. Shaq is a clown and his words hold no weight. Besides, everytime Shaq pens his mouth, he validates Jerry Buss and Kobe for wanting him gone.

Although, it would be great to see Kobe fire back verbally. He can probably hand shaq his big fat *** in eight different laguages. :lol:

 

Shaq is an ***, but come on.........freestyles are harmless.

 

Unless Shaq's doing it. Worst rapper I ever heard.

 

i thought this was quite comical when i saw it on tv tonight. I laughed. Maybe thats because I dont like Kobe... Nor do I like Shaq though... and i really dont like basketball either. I just thought it was hilarious(yet sad at the same time) that its even happened.

 

Shaq is jealous because he knows any chance he had at another ring is gone in the rear view mirror

 

Duh...Eminem is the ****

 

Oh my god somehow Kobe gets bashed by you again. Kobe does make his teammates better. Considering MJ played with another member of the Top 50 players of all time, why is he given so much credit for making players better? It seems to me that Scottie Pippen was quite the player himself without MJ. But no one ever chalks up some of MJ's success to having great teammates.

Nope. They just go ahead and heap all the credit onto Michael like he played with a 11 piles of poo that he shat out after a bad mexican meal. In other words, Kobe never had anyone as good as Pippen to run with. That includes Snaq.

 

Pippen didn't exactly light the world on fire in Houston.

 

True, but he wasn't in his prime at that point either.

Furthermore, Jordan never won a thing without Pippen. Pippen got to the ECF without Jordan. My guess though is that is widely ignored for the sake of holding MJ up on this pedastool that even Jordan probably looks at and laughs.

I should clarify my stance too. I don't think Kobe is better than Jordan. Do I think they are close in terms of talent? Yes, I do. I think Kobe grew up emulating Jordan and at this point, he mimmicks the way he walked, talked and played hoops. In my opinion, Kobe can do the best MJ impression in the world.

I think MJ isn't the best basketball player that ever lived. I think he was hyped up above and beyond what he was and will forever be canonized as the best. Personally, I would take any of the following BEFORE MJ if I was starting an all time team: Magic, Wilt (who I think is the greatest ever) and perhaps Kareem...perhaps.

I think Kobe gets a bad rap because there is always going to be a backlash when you are great, especially in today's slum ridden media. I think fans are easily manipulated by the press. The argument that Kobe doesn't make his teammates better is something completely fabricated by certain media types and is then floated to the masses for their consumption. Unfortunately most people are willing to eat it up as the look for an excuse to tear Kobe down.

I also think, when you remind people so much of their hero, an icon and supposedly the best ever, people tend to expect more out of you, unrealistic goals that, even if Kobe were to attain them, it wouldn't be enough.

I suppose that is why, above everything else, I defend him. Yes I am a Lakers fan and yes I am bias. But often people are far too willing to discount what Kobe has done. People act like he hasn't won anything or done anything in this league and it simply is not true. And when they DO acknowledge it, it is always with a condition. He won three championships, but it was because of Shaq and Phil Jackson. He never won a league MVP, oh and when he does, it was because it is more of a lifetime achievement award as opposed to something he rightfully earned.

It is BS and it grows tiresome after awhile. Unfrotunately for Kobe, he is TOO much like Jordan. They both cheat on their wives, yell and scream and chastize teammates in public and often times ignore what the coaching staff is telling them while they play G.M. in the press and spend their money on ridiculous things (Jordan is a degenerate gambler and Kobe is still trying to buy his wife's forgiveness).

I think the question for me is, why do players like MJ and Shaq get a pass for the atrocious behaviors, yet Kobe is grilled over the coals for every transgression, real or fabricated? It just astonishes me.

 

Listening to Shaq gives you an idea what it would sound like if Frankenstein put out an album.

 

Pippen would never have been a top 50 player (questionable that he's on that list IMO) without Jordan. I like Pippen a lot, he and Jordan were a great duo but lets not get crazy. For some odd reason people seem to forget Shaq in his prime, the guy was a force of nature, one of the best centers of all time, in a class with Kareem, Wilt, Robinson, Hakeem, etc. Pippen is maybe hovering around the top 5 SFs of all time. He was a great player but no GM in the history of the NBA would take Pippen over Shaq.
Kobe was being talked about, before the Celtics series of course, as the Greatest EVER. He was being talked about as being BETTER than Jordan. This is silly. He has never been nor will he ever be better than Jordan. Kobe was great this year, I think he rightfully deserved the MVP, but people got out of control calling him the best ever. People do this a lot when a player has a great year, they seem to act as though no one else has ever had a great year or had a great playoff run. Kobe was great this year but it did get out of control.
On the subject of Shaq and Kobe, I can't blame Shaq for hating Kobe, it was obvious to everyone that Kobe was angling to get rid of Shaq pretty much from day one. Throwing Shaq's dirty laundry out there is also ridiculous, team mates, co-workers, friends, etc just don't do this to another person. Its none of your business getting involved in someone else's marriage, especially when you are out cheating yourself and 'settling an undisclosed amount' with a woman that you "didn't force yourself on" yet paid to drop the civil case....

 

Wilt Chamberlain
Kareem Abdul Jabbar
Bill Russell
Hakeen Olajuwan
Moses Malone

All centers I would take before Shaq.

As for Pippen, he did win 6 championship alongside Jordan and get the Bulls to the ECF without him. In fact, they were one game away from going back to the finals. One of the best defenders of all time and a first ballot hallf of famer. When Jordan left in 94, Pippen led the league in steals and avaeraged over 22 points a game. He also won the All Star MVP and finished third for the league MVP. 3x All NBA first teamer, 8x NBA defensive first teamer.

Pippen was a great player, Jordan or no.

 

If you ask me they are both wrong and should stop putting their business in the street like two girls, but whatever.

 

I would agree, but only one person is ou there pissing an moaning about anything right now. Kobe has been silent as can be on the subject of Shaq, going so far as to refuse answering questions about the "beef" from reporters who won't let it go.

But your statement is the norm. Kobe getting blamed for something Shaq is doing. I suppose it is just engrained in us to heap blame on the guy.

 

As much as I despise Kobe that rap was incredibly lame.

 

key word right now. Kobe has taken his shots at shaq in the public eye. And FYI kobe is not well liked because of Kobe, please stop trying to martyr the guy.

 

the rap was pretty funny but Shaq needs to "let it go". Why do you have to diss both Kobe and Kareem??

 

When was thelast time Kobe said anything negative about Shaq? Without looking I would have to say off the top of my head it was when they were teammates FOUR years ago. I am sure he has said things in private, but he has not gone public with any derogatory comments since he criticizes the Big Lazy for deciding to forego surgery until the season started because "He was injured on company time, so he will heal on comapny time."

Quite frankly, Kobe was right to rip him apart about that, the media swept it under the rug. If Kobe had said that? There is no teling how badly he would have been ripped.

Honestly though, I can't think of anything he has said about Shaq since that was bad in public. Feel free to correct me as I may be forgetting something.

And I am not martyring the guy. Just pointing out that the guy is unfairly blamed for things he has little to no part in (like this "fued") or no control over (MJ comparisons).

 

Sorry Sam,m whether its your man love for Kobe or opposite for Michael you are totally off.

I will say this as it is about the ONLY way to compare Apples and Apples. Put MJ in Kobe's place in this last championship, there is ZERO doubt the Lakers win it..probably in 5

Put Kobe in Michaeil's place on the Bulls...not only is Pippen NOT regarded as one of the top 50 (Probably not top 75..maybe not 100) but all those Chicago rings disappear baby. GONE

 

it does not matter if he has not done it recently, the point is he has done it. You can justify him doing it further for whatever reason, but he should expect as you should, that regardless of how right you think he is, his criticism will not go over well and it would suit him to just stay away from the subject of shaq altogether. Yes shaq should let it go, but the fact is there is a beef because of both of them even if the actions are in the past so to speak.
And yes you are martyring kobe or attempting to, he is under scrutiny because of alot of his actions again be those in the past. Everything has repercussions, and even if he is still feeling those repercussions he is feeling them because of something he did. He should not nor should you expect anything different, as the rest of us would also have to feel the effects of our mistakes be them far in the past.

 

That is just crazy. You really have to hate SHAQ to even attempt to put Moses Malone over Shaq in a best center of all-time discussion.

The WORST...and I mean the bargain basement WORST he can be is #5 behind the others you mentioned.

You couldn't find ONE..not ONE GM that would take Pippen over SHAQ. Not One. In fact...Jordan wouldn't take Pippen over SHAQ! PIPPEN wouldn't take Pippen over SHAQ.

 

who cares, both Shaq and Kobe are, as human beings, garbage. theyre both extremely immature and are not good role models for kids to look up to, despite what the NBA tries to do with them. Of course it is my opinion that no athletes are good role models for kids. But back in the NBA's hayday in the 80s and 90s, you never had this crap between Jordan and his teammates, bad as they were before the Bulls run, and you never heard Bird complain about his guys, and the same for Kareem. Its just further proof that the NBA is on a serious decline, in talent, integreity of the insitution, and the concept of a team. THe NBA has increasingly favored star players to showcase instead of really good teams. Despite the Spurs' success, the NBA does not market the Spurs a great team, an image to project to others the sprit of being a team and dividing responsibilities, playing to each other's strengths, ect. Instead, its Kobe, its LeBron, its Shaq, its Melo, its AI, its D-Wade. There is no promotion on the NBA's part of team unity, it just praises and emphasizes individual achievements. Even in the era of Jordan, which is the origins of this mindset. Shaq and Kobe make enough money to live several lifetimes without having to ever work again. Why are they so bitter? Why are still feuding after all these years?

Who cares?

 

But that IS THE POINT. You said both of them are wrong and need to shut up about it. Well Kobe HAS shut up abotu it. He hasn't said word one in what? Four years? Yet he still gets lumped in with Shaq's sour grapes. Guarenteed if the shoe was on the other foot, no one would be saying THEY need to drop it, just KOBE. And that is what I don't understand. Kobe is getting hit with shrapnel today even though he quit the war close to half a decade ago. Tell me how is that right?

Yes there are reprecussions for one's actions, but you can't expect to hold ONE person to that standard and not the other(s). And that is what is happening here.

No one (besides me apparently) is willing to call Shaq out for being out of shape, whining himself off of two teams now, having bad relationships with players all over the league that he used to run with and quite possibly being the most selfish athlete alive. He gets a pass. Why is that? I am fascinated by it.

As for the MJ stuff, there is nothing Kobe can do about that. He gets compared by everyone out there and is then belittled for not living up to it. I can say the criticism is warranted if Kobe came out and said he was better than MJ or is planning on doing everything MJ did etc. But Kobe has never said that. In fact, he has asked that the comparisons stop because in his mind, MJ is in a class by himself.

But even when Kobe shows a rare humble quality to everyone, he is lambasted for it. I am not martyring the guy. Just defending someone. I don't see why everytime someone defends or stands up for someone else they are "martyring them."

 

Again, I think the Kobe/MJ comparisons are unfair. I think MJ was a better overall player.

However, if you want to argue about it, you can make the argument that Jordan never really played against a zone defense as it was allowed until Shaq was just runing roughshod on everyone (I am of the belief that the zone defense was implemented to help slow down Shaq, above all else).

MJ versus a zone and that Celtics team? My money is on Boston. Sorry, it just is.

I also think that Chicago would still have championships if Kobe and MJ were swapped at the same ages. They may not have 6, but then again, Kobe doesn't leave for two years to play baseball so maybe they do?

 

I am far from letting Shaq off the hook and as was mentioned, I think he and Kobe are not that different. Difference is, he warmed to people whereas Jellybean junior just shat on the public, pooh poohed former teammates and ownership

I dont care for either as a human being to be honest.

 

I agree about Kobe and Shaq not being good role models, but there ARE good role models in sports. Someone like Derek Fisher is soeone kids could and should emulate. Larry Bird, Steve Young, Emmit Smith, Nolan Ryan, Greg Maddux. All hard working very nice individuals who play the game with respect and lead normal, decent lives (as far as we know) off the field. There are more, but for the sake of space, I will stop here.

I also disagree that Bird/Magic/Kareem and the players of yesteryear didn't get on their teammates or speak about them in public. Magic had his coach fired so that Pat Riley could come in. Isiah Thomas used to claim racism as did many of the Pistons in the 80's. Jordan used to call his teammates "******s," and berate them in front of fans and media types all the time.

The difference? The media. They report on every little thing and blow things out of proportion to a degree never seen before. Those transgressions in the past didn't have the wave of multimedia that the players today have to deal with. Sound clips were only played on the local news and newspapers the next day. Today? You have 24 hour sports networks, sports radio and of course, the internet. Quite possibly the biggest thing to happen in our lifetime is the ability to share information worldwide within seconds of each other.

with that, it allows for quotes and missteps to be spread everywhere without anyone having a governer and asking, "Is this really a story?" That is why some things in the past never made the papers or were quickly forgotten because the bottom line was, there was more time to make sure sources were correct and the proper stories reported on.

Rant off. :lol:

 

But when has Kobe "shat on the public?" And the ownership argument doesn't fly. Jerry Buss has stated many times that he regards Kobe like a son of his.

SHAQ, on the other hand, has shat on the public, pooh poohed former teammates (Penny, Eddie Jones, Kobe etc.) and demanded during the middleof a game to scream at his owner to "PAY ME OR TRADE ME!" All the while he grew fatter and fatter and refused to workout in the Summer as he claimed that was his time and would recover on company time.

Pathetic.

 

Oh please it is not like I took Manute Bol and Shawn Bradley over Shaq. All of those gys are Hall of Fame Centers, and game changers, much like Shaq. I think Shaq benefitted from not having to bang against defensive mind centers all the time.

I think it would have been fun to plop Shaq down in the 80's and see how he fared against guys like Kareem, Moses, Hakeem ( a younger Hakeem) and others.

I think Shaq is probably more agile than Moses, but I think Moses would have given him fits in the paint. Moses was a strong cat and would have had no reservations about using is fouls on the Big Feller.

I will say this though, Shaq is one of the few that changed the game in that, they have implemented rules to slow him down (zone defenses). Which is a credit to how good and dominant he is/was.

 

Its all good. I expect it when I talk about Kobe. Not everyone is as enlightened as me. :D

Having said that though, This thread is severely cutting into my work/Howard Stern time, so I will have to bow out at this point I think. :hi5:

 

Oh cmon. Every single time they interview him, he is a VERY SMUG CONDESENDING LITTLE A-HOLE> Every single time.

He doesnt give a rats *** about ANYBODY but himself and he has made it very appearant....well that and teenage blondes in Utah....

 

No my point is even if now he decides to walk away the fact remains he participated in it. You are trying to make it seem like because kobe dropped it everyone else should, but the world does not work the way, for anyone, so why should it for kobe?

I said both are acting like girls so I will assume this is directed at someone else.

Shaq gets a pass because how he played the media and the fans. Be it kobe is picked on a bit, he has still not helped his situation any with his attitude and yes, his desire to chase off those who he does not agree with, and his trouble with the law. Again that is kobe's doing, not anyone elses. It maybe be perpetuated by others but Kobe could simply come off as a class act, but Kobe often just says/does the wrong things. And the most selfish athlete alive thing is waaaaaaaaaaaay overstated. I can name a couple of athletes who often get into trouble, are cancers in the locker room etc.

Standing up for someone is saying hey he isn't that bad, pretending he is mostly a victim of circumstance and other people, which it seems to me you are doing, is martyring IMO.

 

See, this is how I know you don't know what you are talking about...it was Colorado... :lol:

Do you think that it is possible that these are just YOUR opinions and preconceived notions about the guy? I agree that Kobe doesn't interview well, but I don't think he comes off like a smug a-hole.

I used to think MJ came off as holier than thou during his interviews too, but it was probably more to me hating how good he was vs. what was actually happening.

I will say this, Kobe is more mature than most people give him credit for. There isn't a SINGLE player that gets more criticism justified or otherwise, about his life, game, personality, etc. No one in the history of the sport has had to deal with as much negativity thrown his way. Bar none.

 

Once again, this argument keeps goign back to Shaq vs. Kobe. Its like debating Pepsi vs. Coke, theres some differences between the two, but overall, theyre both bad for you.