All I know about him is he punched Shane Lechler in the eye.

 

i was thinking the same thing. there are a few players out there i would like to look at, terdell sands being one of them. i think he would be a decent addition

 

I think we've got enough Raider cast offs as is....wish we could get a do over on the two we signed in FA




JS

 

groves and moses?

 

Groves & Wilson.
But, you are right that Moses is another Raiders cast-off.

 

Can you at least give Groves and Wilson a chance to play in real game time before writing them off?

 

Isn't it curious that Satele couldn't even crack the starting lineup in Oakland. Should we have kept Satele and let Grove go elsewhere? Any improvement over what we had is a plus. We will see as the season progresses whether they are an improvement or not over what we had.

 

we've done very well acquiring Dallas & Raider players
Parcells likes the big boys up front, just might work out

 

I find it curious that Satele could even make a final 53....and so far, I find it scary that we paid Grove what we did. This past draft was LOADED with good talent at the Center position.

Not only do we have to hope Grove starts to show us something, we also have to pray he stays healthy.....and we got ALL this for a measly 14 million guaranteed I believe.

And Wilson?........the guy has yet to even sniff a pass while it's in the air.

So far both have been a huge disappointment and if things don't turn around, these signings are going to seriously hinder the future progress of this team.


JS

 

He sounds like a perfect fit for Oakland.

 

He means Gibril Wilson. (EDIT: Im wrong) we did not trade for grove

Gibril and Bell are going to look like a mess out there until the coaching staff decides which one they like better and makes him the SS, with the other sitting on the bench for a better coverage guy on the field instead. Neither can cover a WR, neither plays center field, neither will do anything useful in deep coverage. They're both glorified linebackers. Which is okay when you're only playing one of them, but right now we're starting both of them, which will be exploited very early. The best these guys can do is cover a TE, but even better TEs in the league are going to beat them.

 

Oh thats right, we traded them satele and then signed groves didnt we? That situation just went so smooth that it still feels like a trade to me.

 

Well we can look at their history to form an opinion. I agree that they haven't played a regular season game in a Miami uni as of yet so the criticism shouldn't be heaped on them, but there is enough of a history to criticize the player. Grove is inconsistent and injury prone, Wilson isn't a ball hawking safety, he doesn't do well in coverage. That isn't premature criticism IMO, that's just an evaluation of the players so far in their career.

I would say no. I hinted at the idea of giving him a look when he was a FA and showed some promise, but all I've read on him lately is that he's one of those guys that can never seem to get over that hump to realize his potential and he shows a poor work ethic. He signed a pretty hefty deal for a backup DT last year and then lost his job this year to a rookie (Desmond Bryant), so I don't see him as an upgrade over what we have.

 

Sands is a interesting scrap pile player, but I would not cut anyone to sign him, far from it, if he does not have the discipline to take care of himself in Oakland we could be importing a problem into Miami.

Our roster has advanced so far that picking a scrap heap player like Sands up makes no sense.

A list of what is laying on the scrap heap:

http://profootball.scout.com/2/896356.html

 

To say he wishes we can have a do over on the two signings based on 4 preseason games as a Dolphin is premature criticism, IMO. We have to see what they can do as Dolphins, not what they did as Raiders, before we form an opinion on them.

 

I'll admit, I've said repeatedly that I want a do over on the Grove signing. He's not on the field nearly enough to be worth that contract IMO and when he is he isn't the player that most folks think he is. I would have much rather spent a few extra mil on Brown or drafted one of the youngsters in the draft.

 

Did you see him play in New York? He was quite good in coverage there. It is an inaccurate evaluation of his career to date to say he doesn't do well in coverage.

 

I did Pete, and I also saw him last year as well. :wink2:

 

Well, our success is predicated on Ireland and Sparano recognizing hidden value and then using it in the manner that produces success, they have been stellar so far so I really do not doubt Wilson or Grove as of yet.

Wilson had 120+ tackles last season that did not happen by accident L2G, as for Grove, we shall see, grading Olinemen in the preseason is a touch over the top don't you think?

 

I agree. I wanted Jason Brown as well. All I'm saying is, to say can we have a do over based on 4 preseason games is ridicolous.

 

I think the reason Wilson had 120+ tackles is because the Raiders run D is awful. So, Wilson had to clean up after the linebackers when the RB got through the LB units.

 

I wouldn't say stellar, me thinks Grove could be Ernest Wilford v2.0 due to his injuries and play. :crapstrom:

I hope I'm wrong. :wink2:

Correct, alot of it had to do with the poor play infront of him leading to more chances. I'm not really concerned about his ability to tackle, it's his ability to recognize, defend and make plays on the ball that has me worried.

 

If you wish to speak of the O-line play I think you might want to reference CK's post regarding the team being tired assed due to the games in x amount of days (11 or something). Does anyone remember how long the starting O-line played in that third game against the Bucs? Into the 4th quarter; long after all the other starters on every other unit were gone. I guarantee that had an affect if the whole team was tired. Think how they'd feel for the next game? A bit sluggish, still worn out? Probably.

They got worked that game too. I would be willing to bet that by this week, those legs will be back under them, and we may see a visibly quicker, sharper performance. We also need to concentrate on getting our G's to the second level more often.

 

For the money he is being paid, I would have liked to have seen more push up the middle. Just saying

That could have been a factor as well

 

That group should be able to play tired after this preseason, that's for sure.

 

I'm sorry but so far our FA signings have been anything but stellar....

I saw an article by The BigO and I think he summed it up quite well "cash for clunkers"

Personally I feel like our FO got in too big of a hurry to win asap and lost sight of the real prize.....and that's building a true contender.

How else can u explain taking a risk on a guy like Grove when the draft was laden with very good Center prospects? They were too impatient to develop someone, so they rolled the dice on Grove.

At some point, these decisions will catch up to us and handcuff us....we'll have too much cap tied up in guys that need to be upgraded.

IMO, we wasted money on Wilson, Grove, Crowder and from the looks of it so far, Carey...and then there's the Wilford debacle and the money we donated to the Eric Allen fund.

I'm hoping someone lights a fire under Carey and Groves rear ends and gets them going......Wilson just is what he is, a liability in coverage. Crowder?...sorry but you can't teach instinct, which is where he is lacking.

Luckily they are better at drafting than they are in FA....


JS

 

:

JT, Fergie, Fasano, Akin A, Don Thomas, Haynos, Pennington, Polite, Carpenter etc etc

All starters L2G...all on the cheap, that is stellar.

Well, look at it this way, even you are right and Wilson cannot cover, Sparano does not keep players out on the field if they are not performing, no matter how large a contract they signed, so if Wilson bombs we will see Clemons or Culver quickly enough.

 

There is simply no way you can prove we wasted money on Grove and Wilson when they didn't even play in one regular season game as Dolphins.

Channing Crowder's contract was a very affordable contract for a player of his caliber, so no money wasted there.

Vernon Carey's contract was a bit hefty, so I agree. Still, based on reports, he's in shape and has been working out with Long all off season. Maybe we see him turn the corner to elite this season.

 

JT and Penny landed in our laps...Carpenter is a Cammy draft pick and Thomas is a draft pick from last season. Haynos and Polite are average at best and the others fall under the "pretty good" category..

I think calling our FA moves "stellar" is being VERY generous..


And yeah Wilson can be replaced but that won't help us as far as the cap hit being wasted on the guy.


JS

 

..

Well, "fell into our laps" works too.

Carpenter was a UDFA find by Irish, as was DBess, and Haynos and Polite are key players a team needs to win games.

Chad Pennington disagree with you.

Cap Hit?

So what?

It's not my money, and Chris Clemmons works cheap.

 

And you can prove I'm wrong? It's an opinion bro, you got yours, I got mine..

I base mine on:

No push up the middle.....the very reason we gave him that hefty contract.

We cut a Safety (Bryan) that made more plays than Wilson

Crowder looks no diff than usual, his first step is generally in the wrong direction. He lacks instinct and I don't see that changing.

Carey looks lethargic out there at best..


You keep saying we can't base anything on 4 preseason games, yet our coaches use these games to determine our roster. So obviously these games are more important and defining than you might think they are..



JS

 

You're right, I got Carpenter confused with the punter......and I forgot Bess, HE was a "stellar" find. The rest, pretty much average

I have a tremendous amount of respect for Penny...that being said, I want him replaced asap

When we're close to contending and we need to either get one more piece or resign a valuable player, where's the money gonna come from if we are over extended due to poor signings? It's not as tho it has no consequence....look at the Marino years, every year was the same....all we could do was shop in the bargain bins because there was no cap room to acquire any impact players



JS

 

the preseason games are normally meant for the backups, not the starters. Guys who aren't in any danger of losing their starting jobs, like crowder, carey and wilson, aren't the ones being examined.

 

I disagree, it's also where the Vets get prepared and gel with each other for the coming season.

And going by Crowder's own words, Sparano is examining EVERYONE in a Fins uniform...


JS

 

Funny.

Plain fact is, none of our impact players, and very few big name players will move until the NFL and the NFLPA hash things out, no one even knows if 2010 will be an uncapped year, if it is, we could see a literal bloodbath of cuts for teams dumping their high salary players who they feel they can replace.

And keep in mind, no salary "cap" also means no salary "floor" teams are not required to spend a certain amount of money, meaning the Bengals could dump Ocho Cinco and suffer no cap hit for doing so.

 

Well thank you, glad I could entertain you........it's the sole reason i logged on today;]

And as far as the no cap year......don't hold your breath on that happening.


JS

 

Bell was a FA too (in the same vain as Carey and Crowder), and Bryan made more plays than Bell this preseason if you think he made more than Wilson, because Wilson has made more plays than Bell.

(though Bryan did not make more plays than Wilson or Bell)