We would be better with Zach (not Zack) but not so much with Taylor. Our first priority should be stopping the run. We can mount a pass rush with Joey Porter and those two draft picks Taylor brought in.

 

For this year at least we will be short without both. Our LB's are pretty weak and were going to miss those fumble sacks from J.T. and Crowder will have to improve a lot in the middle from his prior 3 years.

Here is to hoping they can pick up a couple good LB's in the draft next year. Hopefully the guys can at least be serviceable this year and come up with 'some' pass rush.

 

I'm not convinced about that. I think the additions of Ferguson, Ayodele, and Torbor will yield immediate results as far as stopping the run. And personally, I don't see how our pass rush could be any worse than last year; Taylor tanked it until we were seriously threatening to go 0-16, and Porter did nothing. This year, it looks like Porter may actually do something, and Roth at OLB has some serious bull rush potential. When it comes to pass-rushing OLBs, I'll gladly go 1 for 2 this year instead of 0 for 2 last year.

Depends on our draft position and what they think of Maualuga and Laurinaitis. Ireland might be hoping both guys are gone before we pick so we can take someone like George Selvie and play him at OLB.

I'm pulling for Malcolm Jenkins, personally.

 

Tanked it? Hahahahahaha. Hilarious.

I don't know if we're better, we haven't played any games yet. C'mon that's something you'd say Desides if it was something that you were arguing against. Like if Parcells has done a good job, etc.

ON PAPER, this team would be better with a healthy Zach Thomas and Jason Taylor. We never had a problem stopping the run any year other than last year with Jason Taylor, especially in 2005, 2006 when we ran 4-3, 3-4, and hybrids. Why would you think it would change?

I'll tell you why, because you don't like the fact he didn't have his best year for a poor team and he was on dancing with the stars and he was an easy scapegoat for you to argue about. That's all.

I will never understand anyone who says that Jason Taylor didn't play with effort, passion, and pride. He played every game for the last 8-9 seasons with injuries, while in walking boots for entire week of practice, hand issues, etc. Yet he was there every game, no matter how much we stunk and played hard every down. Was he good on every down? Maybe not, but he was 100% effort.

:no:

 

We shall see. We only had 30 sacks last year and I honestly don't see this front 7 coming up with 30 sacks.

 

Hard to say. I like the way this young defense looks, but it's awful hard to take away 2 potential hall of famers from a roster and claim it's better. But maybe the chemistry with the younger guys will be special and maybe that bond wouldn't be there if Zach and Jason were still around. Time will tell. I do think in the longrun we will be better off without Jason because of the picks he brought in. But we got nothing for Zach and he was a special player.

 

I love both players enough not to touch this thread with a 10 foot opinion. They are gone, I am sad about it, but I choose to look forward, not back. And I like what I think our future is going to look like, that is all I care about.

 

Well the short term answer is that we would, in fact, be better with those two guys...you can't deny the production they'd probably give us. The long term is that even tho we may not be better this year as you said, we'll be better in the next couple of years because of getting younger and allowing our youngsters to develop...Additionally, we'll get an extra boost from the draft picks we get from JT...

So, to say that we'd be better without them this year is probably not right..but for the future...moving them is the smart thing to do...

 

I'd take a healthy Zach and JT over anyone on our defense. Honestly, I'd prefer to have our current set with Zach and JT and minus Porter.

 

I did. Tho I love Zach and wanted him to stay. It wasnt so much talent as a need to start fresh, get young and allow them to go compete. They did not fit a rebuild and it wa clear we were rebuilding. We were better as a team because they couldnt use them as a crutch and rely on them, they didnt need teh distraction of 2 aging vets, especially JT, who were impatient to win.

 

Zach is a special player, still is and will improve that cowboy defense bigtime by diagnosing the plays before they happen, what an advantage to a already talented defense.

Back to the question..........jason taylor...no, i'll take the pick, but i would love to see zach having fun out there with our new guys, he would be telling them where to run and what to hit, and he would be acting like a little kid doing so.

I truly am rooting for the cowboys this year in the NFC and WILL shed a tear if our boy makes it to the dance.

 

I would love to see Zach hoisting a Lombardi... presuming he can pry it out of Jerry Jones' slimy hands.

 

I don't see how Selvie projects to OLB.

 

it's too early to tell....of course it's hard for me to see us winning 6-7 games this year too...but it's still do-able.

my answer to the topic at hand is that knowledge and experience-wise we're going to fall short this season but talent-wise I think we'll do - ok - without them. not to say they won't be missed, and I for one was quite comfortable with them holding up our D....but it seems as if - yet again - we are heading in a new direction and I for one have been pretty impressed with our top prospect. I really haven't heard much talk about Long from any sportscasters yet. Usually they do some sort of spread to follow the progress of a #1 pick....

 

Boy, I don't know, its way to early to tell.

I saw Zach the last two preseason games and buy he looks good, I would rather have Zach than Crowder.

I do think we are better team chemisty wise without Taylor's drama, but will miss his play.

 

I can't believe that this is really a question.....

absolutely yes, without any question this team would be better with JT and ZT.

it's amazing to me how the ability of a player evaporates once they leave Miami, and how players become instantly better (ie - Pennington) once they come to Miami.

 

I think Miami got rid of both at the right time. Their reign on this D had come to an end and now they'll run down there careers on someone else' payroll.

Should have seen it coming really, Parcels likes his people in and running the show, and not just on the sidelines. A guy like JT is a little to big of a personality to keep around and not have to worry about dissension in the ranks. I think your defense will be better as a result of it, even in the short term.

 

I couldn't have said it better myself! Zach is the man! That Hard Knocks segment was epic! In case anyone missed it in episode 2 they had a whole segment on Zach... He was even playing as punt-returner!

 

As much as I loved both players I'm glad they're both gone, because what it symbolizes is that the team is finally rebuilding. No more half-assed jobs. This regime has torn the foundation to the bottom and rebuilt it anew, something has has been needed since Wanny left us.

 

:tantrum:I've NEVER heard JT say anything bad in the press. All I heard was THE PRESS saying he didn't want to be hear. They started fires to see what they could burn and many people here threw fuel on it. I would like to see one link to any report that has JT *****ing and moaning to the press. It isn't there. Don't get caught up in the propaganda the media dishes out. Most of it is just hype to sell papers.

 

Welcome to the #1 Homer board in the world. :yes:

 

Well, since we have not played one game without Zach and JT on our team I can't say if we're better or worse.
To say preseason games count is clearly a miscommunication between what eyes read and brain thinks. But thats just me.

So to say I have always thought Zach Thomas was a great team player, always doing what was needed. I will miss his play on our team.
JT was great when fired up, but I've seen him become more and more neutralized by other teams.
I'm glad they were Dolphins. But until we play real games without them, no one can say.

 

It looks like the Redskins may have been better off without Taylor, too. He got caught up in their preseason game tonight and has what they're calling a knee strain now. He had to be carted off and it didn't look particularly promising according to reports.

 

I read he walked off himself http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80a39665&template=without-video&confirm=true

 

He eventually limped off the field but was carted off to the locker room.

 

Question: Who would have thought we would be better off without Zach and Jason?

Answer: Bill Parcells


Results: end.of.thread!

 

ahh

 

It's not like the only difference in our D is that ZT and JT have been jettisoned. Our defense should be better overall b/c we are better at DT and our secondary is healthy, but we are not better off without ZT (healthy) and JT. Also I expect that Porter and many other players will be used more effectively this year. I really think Capers did a poor job last season even though he's been a good coach in the past.

 

Count me as glad they're both gone. I think we've needed new leadership and defensive identity for a loooong time.

Great players but questionable leaders, IMO.

 

I don't think we are better because Zach and JT are gone....I think we are better because Saban and Cameron are gone, and Parcells and Sparano are here with a new attitude!!! :yes:

 

I think the culture of losing had infected others and even zach admitted in interviews "here we go again" in reference to tanking as a defense. Zach always played with pride. Even the best of us sometimes get down and lose confidence sometimes. Loss of confidence on the defensive side of the ball is a killer. You lose your killer instinct. As good as some of those teams were they tanked late in the season in critical games. This was as much the coaching staffs fault as it was the players. The anemic offenses we had didn't help. Even though their individual contributions were great the loss of both Zach and Jason have given new players an opportunity to step up. Like it or not you wont find anyone more critical of himself than Zach. We needed a fresh start or a clean sweep. Zach and Jason's skills covered other glaring problems in our defense. Their loss forced a honest look and required a retooling of the defensive line and some of the LB corp and I think we are better for it. Maybe not this year, but soon and for a long time.

 

I actually do believe that while Thomas had his success in the penetration scheme of Nick Saban in 2006, this version of the 3-4 would overwhelm him. He would not be free to make plays as he was in that hybrid but rather would struggle at the stack and shed in the middle of the defense.

Taylor could have helped, but I do like the fact that we've been able to so far get something out of Roth by putting him at LOLB. At the same time we've also made Porter more effective by putting him back at ROLB.

If we can save our 2005 second round pick by putting him at LOLB then mission accomplished. Sparano and the trio have done their best to save Roth, Crowder, Allen, and Hagan form the bust category. So far so good but we'll see...