Why did we cut Matt Roth?

He refused to drink the kool-aid.

"Killerphins wrote:

Ah hell he was 26... Transitioned real well
You keep Taylor and Porter. Anderson and Moses
Should have traded Joey when the value was up...
Everyone thinks Crowder will show up.
My rant......

I think it ALL comes down to $-worth play.

Exactly how effective has Roth been with Cleveland?

Clem Chowder SUCKS, and I doubt we ever see him play another down in Miami.

"azfinfanmang wrote:

I think it ALL comes down to $-worth play.

Exactly how effective has Roth been with Cleveland?

Clem Chowder SUCKS, and I doubt we ever see him play another down in Miami.

Roth had two sacks last week. I would call that effective.

Sources say he took a dump in the back seat of Bill Parcells's Oldsmobile.

"Killerphins wrote:

Roth had two sacks last week. I would call that effective.

And at some point he will be injured again with that groin. He's got a chronic groin injury that plagued him every year he was here. Not to mention he was lying about the injury...pretty much admitted it in an article in the offseason out in Cleveland.

"VanDolPhan wrote:

And at some point he will be injured again with that groin. He's got a chronic groin injury that plagued him every year he was here. Not to mention he was lying about the injury...pretty much admitted it in an article in the offseason out in Cleveland.

And yet we continue to keep Crowder who is always hurt and lies with his play on the field so your point holds no water. Roth is a force in the Browns defense now and could still be here. Cutting Roth was one of the few beefs I have with this regime along with keeping Crowder.

"Killerphins wrote:

And yet we continue to keep Crowder who is always hurt and lies with his play on the field so your point holds no water. Roth is a force in the Browns defense now and could still be here. Cutting Roth was one of the few beefs I have with this regime along with keeping Crowder.

At that point in both their careers, Crowder had done a lot more than Roth. Roth had a few DECENT games at the end of 2008 while Crowder doubled him statistically while starting one less game.

I think you should have beef with Roth, not the Dolphins. He had yet to do anything in the league and wanted a huge pay raise. He was holding the Dolphins hostage trying to get a new contract. One that he had yet to earn. I've seen this front office reward players for their play more than a few times so my guess is if Roth had kept his mouth shut, played, and played well, he would have been in negotiations at the midway point of 2009 for a nice raise.

He's just not a Parcells guy. Simply put.

Unfortunately, well, thankfully not anymore.... it was a requirement to be classified as one.

"Ozzy wrote:

At that point in both their careers, Crowder had done a lot more than Roth. Roth had a few DECENT games at the end of 2008 while Crowder doubled him statistically while starting one less game.

I think you should have beef with Roth, not the Dolphins. He had yet to do anything in the league and wanted a huge pay raise. He was holding the Dolphins hostage trying to get a new contract. One that he had yet to earn. I've seen this front office reward players for their play more than a few times so my guess is if Roth had kept his mouth shut, played, and played well, he would have been in negotiations at the midway point of 2009 for a nice raise.

Roth had five sacks in 2008 and transitioned from DE to OLB in one offseason. He was great at setting the edge against the run. He was only 26 at the time and well worth keeping. Not having Roth around really hurt the defense last season IMO and we should have kept him. It was a glaring mistake by the FO. BTW Crowder has 2-1/2 sacks in six seasons Matt Roth has 18 in the same time span. I know they don't play the same position so it is a difficult comparison but Roth makes bigger plays than Crowder. He is a tougher football guy who makes the defense better. Crowder doesn't do that.
We cut the wrong guy. :up:

"High Definition wrote:

He's just not a Parcells guy. Simply put.

Unfortunately, well, thankfully not anymore.... it was a requirement to be classified as one.

I know this regime didn't draft him if that is what you mean.
If not please explain to me exactly what you mean by that.....
He did everything they asked him to do.

"Killerphins wrote:

Roth had five sacks in 2008 and transitioned from DE to OLB in one offseason. He was great at setting the edge against the run. He was only 26 at the time and well worth keeping. Not having Roth around really hurt the defense last season IMO and we should have kept him. It was a glaring mistake by the FO. BTW Crowder has 2-1/2 sacks in six seasons Matt Roth has 18 in the same time span. I know they don't play the same position so it is a difficult comparison but Roth makes bigger plays than Crowder. He is a tougher football guy who makes the defense better. Crowder doesn't do that.
We cut the wrong guy. :up:

Crowder absolutely makes this defense better. He is an excellent complimentary player, just like Roth, except Roth had only been that for a half a season with Miami.

Five sacks as a starting OLB in a 3/4 defense is not impressive at all. He had the other side of him being double teamed constantly.

What was impressive about Roth was that as the year went on, he improved, and for his first season at OLB (as you mentioned), he showed promise. By no means did he earn a big pay raise, which is what he wanted. His career to date was average at best. And he is the one who tried handcuffing this team for more money. The team did not do anything but want to see him play during the preseason and his mysterious injury (cough B cough S), um I mean, his want for a new contract got him cut.

I would have liked for them to have kept him but I like the way they did not take his crap.

"Killerphins wrote:

I know this regime didn't draft him if that is what you mean.
If not please explain to me exactly what you mean by that.....
He did everything they asked him to do.

LOL except play when he was asked to....

After this regime took him from being a barely average DE in the 4/3 and switched him to the promising OLB in the 3/4, he desides it's in his best interest to sit out and ask for big money.

"High Definition wrote:

He's just not a Parcells guy. Simply put.

Unfortunately, well, thankfully not anymore.... it was a requirement to be classified as one.

He was a Parcells guy actually. Not by draft but by measurements. He fits right into what he likes as an OLB.

You lost me with crowder makes defense better. What a laugh.

"gunn34 wrote:

You lost me with crowder makes defense better. What a laugh.

Well, he is good at chasing the play down from behind...usually WAY behind...... like 15 yards behind.....:wink2:

"gunn34 wrote:

You lost me with crowder makes defense better. What a laugh.

Seems to me, you have selevtive reading.

Read wth i said after that and if you cannot agree with it, you simply hate him as a player. Who would you rather have on defense right now.....Dobbins, or Crowder? Hmmm

"azfinfanmang wrote:

Well, he is good at chasing the play down from behind...usually WAY behind...... like 15 yards behind.....:wink2:

When he is the best Lber on his team, thats true. But when he is the complimentary Lb, he is good and you see far less of those type plays.

Kp you miss the whole point. Yes Roth was an up and coming promising young player. But he did not earn a pay raise just yet given the scenarios Ozzy laid out for you. He was threatned by the presence of Jason Taylor playing essentially the same position as he in our 3-4 and felt he needed to hold out to pressure the regime to sign him to a new contract as a way of assuring both job security and money in case he gets hurt. He was insisting that he had been battling a nagging groin injury but it did not prevent him from playing the year before. The injury supposedly carried over into camp so he held out, even when medical reports came back negative. He subsequently never played another down for us. Good riddance, when you hold out and lie about an injury, its a stupid way to compete and endure in the business world of the NFL. He's not exactly lighting it up in Cleveland, but he works well as a complimentary player in a 3/4 and probably would have more impact as a DE in a 4/3(his natural position) IMO.

But anyways, ya, you wanted us to keep this moron?

And on Crowder, how well has our defense looked since he's been injured going back to last year? Yea, get back to me on that.

"Ozzy wrote:

When he is the best Lber on his team, thats true. But when he is the complimentary Lb, he is good and you see far less of those type plays.

Nope, I dont agree at all.

Clem Chowder SUCKS

I don't care if he is the primary, secondary or tertiary ILB. He is NOT a good ILB.

"FinSane wrote:

And on Crowder, how well has our defense looked since he's been injured going back to last year? Yea, get back to me on that.

Right, and our defense looked so good before he got hurt as well :lol:

This is getting really silly

"azfinfanmang wrote:

Right, and our defense looked so good before he got hurt as well :lol:

This is getting really silly

We held up much better against the run with him on the field.

"azfinfanmang wrote:

Right, and our defense looked so good before he got hurt as well :lol:

This is getting really silly

ill take karlos dansbys word over our fans that hate crowder.

a blind bat could see how much our defense dropped off without him last season.

He was flying around and making tackle for loss in the preseason before the injury

and yes crowder is not the best.....but he is lightyears better than the crap combination of dobbins/barbie

"FinSane wrote:

We held up much better against the run with him on the field.

And got absolutely TORCHED by every RB and TE in the passing game.

He is what he is... a mediocre ILB.