This is different for a couple of reasons: 1) Not the same GM. and 2) Most importantly, no one considered James a reach based on talent. He was only a reach because he probably could of been had later in the first with a trade down. They all think he's a day one starter and long term fix at the position, plus there's a potential he can replace Albert later.

 

Martin, Jerry, Beck, Allen, Brown, and Fletcher (iirc) weren't viewed a reaches in their drafts. Just because a pick doesn't pan out doesn't mean it was a reach (although it still could be). I'm too young to know if the others were reaches or not.

 

I do think a lot of people consider James a reach based on talent. In fact, it appears that most people did not have him as a first round talent. I'm not too hung up on that because in a draft like this, the guys between 15 and 50 or so are all about equal in "talent" -- the differences are much smaller than some people make it seem and everyone has their own preferences among those 30-40 players. But there is certainly no consensus that James is a first round talent -- I think there are a lot of people that don't even have him in that group between 15 and 50 or so.

 

Of the guys listed, really only Moore, Avery, Kumerow and White were really reaches, and there's not even complete consensus on that. Just about all the other guys were drafted right around where they were expected to be, give or take 5-10 picks.

 

Where they rank them is irrelevant in that range. What matters is that almost to a man, they say James is a plug and play long term starter at RT. Taking a guy who is considered that good, in the bottom of the first, at a position of need can never be a "talent" reach (the day after the pick).

 

All that matters at this time is, can he come in and be a quality starter immediately for a team in desperate need of offensive linemen? If he can, it won't matter if he was a reach in the first round or not. If he struggles in 2014 and can't help on the offensive line, it will just be considered another failure on the part of the Dolphins personnel division, Ireland or not. Time will tell.

 

I have no issues at all with someone complaining about the pick..or if we got the value needed. What I get annoyed with is:

Fire Hickey..bring back Ireland. HUGE REACH....
We are screwed..

All rage hating...honestly..nobody will ever complain if you bring your game..make a statement, and bring logical coheront arguments to support your statement.

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Hickey and Philbin went to Lazor and said..tell us what kind of player you want at tackle. Lazor wanted size..and arm length. James is big..he is strong..(with 35 inch arms ..bench press is NOT ..the best test of strength. )..CK has watched a TON of tape on James..and has seen him render very good pass rushers..in the SEC...basically moot. Look at todays defenses..teams are going after fast pass rushing DEs on both sides..James fit exactly what we both needed..and want. 49 games started at RT in the SEC. The guy pleaded with Hickey to come play in Miami...he WANTED to be a Phin..thats freakin cool. He is known as a hard core worker...no question of effort to be the best.

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It's really bizarre when you look at past drafts for many teams. Aside from a few special drafts, most drafts for most teams are filled with guys who amount to nothing or nothing special. You hit on a couple or a few decent to good players and you're doing pretty good as far as the average for successful drafts.

 

I guess the real question is 'Was there a trade partner that was viable and still allowed us to pick up James later on?' I'm just not convinced the answer is as simple as "we should have traded down and taken James later"...it just isn't...

 

I'm positive about the pick. I spent half an hour watching videos while my class worked. He looks handy, he looked good pass blocking that's for sure. Reach or not is surely irrelevant, we filled a need with the best available player. I'm happy.

 

Exactly..if it were this simple..dont you think Hickey would have done this? Dude is a professional...its not like we have Carl Spackler for a GM.

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Who knows?

Again, all that really matters is that the guys we do pick pan out, especially form the first 2 rounds.

 

When somebody says "they have faith" or that the people in charge of the franchise know more the thought that springs to mind is "why would anyone think that?" Reality is that this organization has not given any of us much reason to believe they know what they're doing. The organizations reputation around the league is very poor. Miami has been nothing above mediocre for a very long time and is largely considered a poorly run organization. So I fully understand that after 30 years of floundering mustering up a large amount of faith for this franchise is difficult at best.

 

I used to be a waive the pompons kind of guy for the team. This organization has pummeled that out of me.

 

Unfortunately the same has happened to many, far too many.

Unfortunately, I'm beginning to laugh out loud when the pompoms come out when anyone in the front office simply farts.

 

I've always been pretty balanced in my praise and criticism of the various decisions although I was generally optimistic. What I can not see any justification for is any belief that "they must have known something" or that they know more than me (or anymore than a trained monkey for that matter). That part has been pummeled away.

 

First off, I have no doubt the Phins got better by picking Da'wuan James. To me, that is the absolute most important thing. It wasn't a 'sexy' pick, but, it was clearly the best pick for this football team. They got their guy. I also think James may have been under-valued by scouts simply because he's a right tackle. But, Right Tackle has tremendous value for the Miami Dolphins, at this time. So, I don't care about 'grades'. That pick was, ultimately, a win for the Dolphins, and they got better.

Secondly, this is a seven-round draft. It's fun to talk about this one single pick, but, we have two more days to go. I think people should hold off on the knee-jerk reactions until we can assess the draft in it's entirety.

 

No John Bosa?

 

I find most of the defenders to be making knee-jerk responses. In general most people have liked the player and felt he filled a need. Most aren't even being critical of him being called a reach. Nobody really cares whether the pick was "sexy". The only consistent criticism has been that we obviously had an opportunity to trade down and get the same player and an extra pick for minimal or no risk and they didn't. You don't need a whole draft to evaluate that decision. Yet most defenders try to defend the player unnecesarily or go for the team knows best line or one of the other repeated excuses. Or they try to pretend that they couldn't have traded down despite the fact that Hickey admitted they did have the option. Reality is that they were so scared they'd lose the player that they didn't make the trade. They most likely didn't know anything more than what everybody else knew. The facts are that no other OL have been picked since. That was largely expected as the needs of those teams didn't make an OL selection likely. The rest of the draft could yield three all-pros, but regardless the decision in the first round was made out of fear and there's nothing wrong or knee-jerk of being critical of it.

 

Nothing wrong at all....at least be somewhat logical in your criticism...thats all I want to see

 

Blaming irrational behavior and bad attitudes on being "damaged" is the American way. Maybe we can get some prescription drugs out of this.

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There's no big disagreement on that from me, but a lot of other people would disagree. There are a lot of OGs and Cs who have been plug and play long term starters taken in the 3-5th rounds and a lot of people would still say they would have been reaches if taken in the first. I see this pick as much like the Todd Wade pick back in 2000. He was also a plug and play RT who started for many years. He was solid but unspectacular. Had be been taken in the 1st round I wouldn't be calling him a bust, but I also wouldn't be touting him as a fantastic pick. And he was taken at #53. Yet even there, I don't see him as a great pick. It was safe and served its purpose. I see James much the same way.

 

A plug and play starter does not mean your using a top 20 pick wisely..

I am confident that he is an upgrade from what we had last year and I have him rated higher than Martin, but I had Martin as a fourth rounder..

Top 20 pick has to give you more than plug and play, you need upside, you need a hi caliber athlete at their position..

 

All those things are positive and exciting.

 

For me it just comes down to the fact that I dont believe in Tannehill anymore. I know he was sacked like crazy last year, but even when given time he just wasn't that sharp. He doesn't throw guys open and doesn't put the ball where players can make a play after the catch. In my opinion, you had a player like Manziel available who has the ability to be a big boom or bust player. He can extend plays with his feet, which gives Wallace time to get open down the field which is exactly what Big Ben did for him that made him so successful. Its taking Jamar Fletcher over Drew Brees all over again because you have Jay Fiedler as your QB, again that's just how I see it.

It would be nice as well to have a discussion over this as opposed to having a bunch of 12 year old PMS'ing girls, just say "your stupid".

 

You dont think being "sacked liked crazy" would make anyone just a little shy in the pocket?

 

Actually, I recall reading a stat break down last year that showed that when given time Tannehill was one of the top 5 QBs in the NFL. Anybody who believes that RT wasn't good when given time is just flat out wrong. The fact is he was one of the best in the league in that circumstance.

 

Yeah I may be devaluing the affect the sacks had on him a bit. He just looked so much like David Carr towards the end of the year I don't know if he will be able to recover.

Raf I remember reading that stat somewhere as well, but I don't see him as a top 5 or even 10 QB no matter how much time he has. He doesnt make the players around him better. He didn't make his terrible offensive line any better.

 

Sham..God himself on earth could not have made that line any better

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I've watched Vick getting absoloutely destroyed behind an Eagles O-Line. Looked like a rabbit in headlights. This is a QB that has legs to get him out of trouble. Its pretty scary how a QB can look with or without protection. Like day and night no matter what the QBs talent level is. I was amazed #17 survived the whole season. Last 2 games of last season.....maybe he didn't but he was lucky he didn't go down a lot earlier.

 

The pick sucks
The player sucks
This team sucks
The owner sucks
The stadium sucks
The weather in NY today sucks
The rest of the draft will suck
Being a Phin fan sucks
Dolphins suck
The cheerleaders suck(well, that's not really a bad thing)
Next season will suck
Next draft will also suck
I'll get back to you after rd 2 which will most likely, you know.........SUCK!!

 

The fact is that with time he was a top 5 QB. You not seeing it doesn't change the fact. I do agree that he didn't make enough happen on his own when the protection broke down for my tastes, but that is just as much on the coaching. I thought the coaches did very little to help him out by using moving pockets and read-options, etc. I fully believe that if RT switched places with Wilson, that RT would be the SB champ and you'd be saying the same things about Wilson. The situation matters and RT was placed in a ****ty situation.

 

The cheerleaders aren't bad.
And I do like the uniform and logo change.

 

[QUOTE=Shamboubou Its taking Jamar Fletcher over Drew Brees all over again because you have Jay Fiedler as your QB, again that's just how I see it.

boubou ya gotta get outta that hideous mindset bro,, take some drugs or take less drugs or take some different drugs or sober up or have a drink,, do something but leave those heinous memories where they belong deep in the darkest recesses of your consciousness, inaccessible unless under hypnosis.

 

You're out of order! You're out of order! The whole trial is out of order! They're out of order! It's just a show! It's a show! It's "Let's Make A Deal"! "Let's Make A Deal"! Hey Frank, you wanna "Make A Deal"?

 

I didn't say it was wise. I said it is NOT a talent reach. Is it a "value" reach? Probably. But he is first round talent.

Your Top 20 pick rule is too big. It should be Top 10. With the rookie scale, Rd 1 Pick 11 through Rd2 Pick 10 are all pretty equal. Some drafts will have more than 10 studs, some will have less.