The offensive line. We all know it is bad right now, albeit hopefully they're just underperforming and not actually this terrible. I didn't expect them to be great, but I didn't expect the run blocking to be so bad either.
Anyway, the running narrative (among a few of them) is that we've spent a ton on the OL since Ireland has been here and he still can't get it right in what has now been 6 (off)seasons. I know some people (likely including myself) have said we haven't really drafted an unusually large number of OL or way more high picks than others, but I don't think any of us have actually went out and compared it. I will try and avoid pointing to the change in offensive philosophy as part of the reason for OL performance (or investment), but perhaps it is something to think about (maybe Ireland can't field an OL with the characteristics Philbin looks for). Anyway, I just want to compare the sheer investment in the Dolphins OL vs those of other teams. I will likely have this be a 2 parter (if not more), and simply start with the draft in this part (I will not be evaluating what picks were good or not because I'm not familiar enough with each team, just simply the investment).
Note: If there is info in parenthesis following a team, that is reflective of where their OL stands for the 2013 season as of today.
Note 2: As of right now I have not included trades into the investments, such as Jason Peters going from Buffalo to Philly a few years ago (that would likely drive the Eagles average pick location up though).
Dolphins OL selections since 2008 (top 5 most sacks):
2008 – Jake Long, Rd 1.1
2008 – Shawn Murphy, Rd 4.110
2008 – Donald Thomas, Rd 6.195
2009 – Andrew Gardener, Rd 6.181
2010 – John Jerry, Rd 3.73
2011 – Mike Pouncey, Rd 1.15
2012 – Jonathan Martin, Rd 2.42
2013 – Dallas Thomas, Rd 3.77
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 3.87
Philadelphia OL selections since 2008 (top 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2008 – Mike McGlynn, Rd 4.109
2008 – Mike Gibson, Rd 6.184
2008 – King Dunlap, Rd 7.230
2009 – Fenuki Tupou, Rd 5.159
2009 – Paul Fanaika, Rd 7.213
2011 – Danny Watkins, Rd 1.23
2011 – Julian Vandervelde, Rd 5.161
2011 – Jason Kelce, Rd 6.191
2012 – Dennis Kelly, Rd 5.153
2013 – Lane Johnson, Rd 1.4
Average OL selections per year: 1.67
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.143
Seattle OL selections since 2008 (top 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2009 – Max Unger, Rd 2.49
2010 – Russell Okung, Rd 1.6
2011 – James Carpenter, Rd 1.25
2011 – John Moffit, Rd 3.75
2013 – Ryan Seymour, Rd 7.220
2013 – Michael Bowie, Rd 7.242
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.103
Buffalo OL selections since 2008 (top 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2008 – Demetress Bell, Rd 7.219
2009 – Eric Wood, Rd 1.28
2009 – Andy Levitre, Rd 2.51
2010 – Ed Wang, Rd 5.140
2010 – Kyle Calloway, Rd 7.216
2011 – Chris Hairston, Rd 4.122
2012 – Cordy Glenn, Rd 2.41
2012 – Zebrie Sanders, Rd 5.144
2012 – Mark Asper, Rd 6.178
Average OL selections per year: 1.5
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.127
Indianapolis OL selections since 2008 (top 5 rush):
2008 – Mike Pollak, Rd 2.59
2008 – Steve Justice, Rd 6.201
2008 – Jamey Richard, Rd 7.236
2009 – Jaimie Thomas, Rd 7.236
2010 – Jacques McClendon, Rd 4.129
2011 – Anthony Castonzo, Rd 1.22
2011 – Ben Ijalana, Rd 2.49
2012 – Justin Anderson, Rd 7.208
2013 – Hugh Thornton, Rd 3.86
2013 – Khaled Holmes, Rd 4.121
Average OL selections per year: 1.67
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.135
Green Bay OL selections since 2008 (top 5 rush):
2008 – Josh Sitton, Rd 4.135
2008 – Breno Giacomini, Rd 5.150
2009 – TJ Lang, Rd 4.109
2009 – Jamon Meredith, Rd 5.162
2010 – Bryan Baluga, Rd 1.23
2010 – Marshall Newhouse, Rd 5.169
2011 – Derek Sherrod, Rd 1.32
2011 – Caleb Schlauderaff, Rd 6.179
2012 – Andrew Datko, Rd 7.241
2013 – David Bakhtiari, Rd 4.109
2013 – JC Tretter, Rd 4.122
Average OL selections per year: 1.83
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.130
NY Giants OL selections since 2008 (bottom 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2009 – William Beatty, Rd 2.60
2010 – Mitch Petrus, Rd 5.147
2011 – James Brewer, Rd 4.117
2012 – Brandon Mosley, Rd 4.131
2012 – Matt McCants, Rd 6.201
2013 – Justin Pugh, Rd 1.19
2013 – Eric Herman, Rd 7.225
Average OL selections per year: 1.17
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.129
Pittsburgh OL selections since 2008 (bottom 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2008 – Tony Hills, Rd 4.130
2009 – Kraig Urbik, Rd 3.79
2009 – AQ Shipley, Rd 7.226
2010 – Maurkice Pouncey, Rd 1.18
2010 – Chris Scott, Rd 5.151
2011 – Marcus Gilbert, Rd 2.63
2011 – Keith Williams, Rd 6.196
2012 – David DeCastro, Rd 1.24
2012 – Mike Adams, Rd 2.56
2012 – Kelvin Beachum, Rd 7.248
Average OL selections per year: 1.67
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.119
Jacksonville OL selections since 2008 (bottom 5 rush, top 5 most sacks):
2009 – Eugene Monroe, Rd 1.8
2009 – Eben Britton, Rd 2.39
2011 – William Rackley, Rd 3.76
2013 – Luke Joeckel, Rd 1.2
Average OL selections per year: .67
Average OL selection location: Rd 1.31
St. Louis OL selections since 2008 (bottom 5 rush):
2008 – John Greco, Rd 3.65
2008 – Roy Schuening, Rd 5.157
2009 – Jason Smith, Rd 1.2
2010 – Rodger Saffold, Rd 2.33
2012 – Rokevious Watkins, Rd 5.150
2013 – Barrett Jones, Rd 4.113
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 3.87
Cleveland OL selections since 2008 (top 5 most sacks):
2009 – Alex Mack, Rd 1.21
2010 – Shawn Lauvao, Rd 3.92
2011 – Jason Pinkston, Rd 5.150
2012 – Mitchell Schwartz, Rd 2.37
2012 – Ryan Miller, Rd 5.160
2013 – Garrett Gilkey, Rd 7.227
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.114
Oakland OL selections since 2008 (top 5 most sacks):
2010 – Jared Veldheer, Rd 3.69
2010 – Bruce Campbell, Rd 4.106
2011 – Stefen Wisniewski, Rd 2.48
2011 – Joseph Barksdale, Rd 3.92
2012 – Tony Bergstrom, Rd 3.95
2013 – Menelik Watson, Rd 2.42
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 3.75
Carolina OL selections since 2008 (top 5 most sacks):
2008 – Jeff Otah, Rd 1.19
2008 – Geoff Schwartz, Rd 7.241
2008 – Mackenzy Bernadeau, Rd 7.250
2009 – Duke Robinson, Rd 5.163
2011 – Zachary Williams, Rd 6.203
2011 – Lee Ziemba, Rd 7.244
2012 – Amini Silatolu, Rd 2.40
2013 – Edmund Kugbila, Rd 4.108
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.158
Denver OL selections since 2008 (top 5 least sacks):
2008 – Ryan Clady, Rd 1.12
2008 – Kory Lichtensteiger, Rd 4.108
2009 – Seth Olsen, Rd 4.132
2009 – Blake Schlueter, Rd 7.225
2010 – Zane Beadles, Rd 2.45
2010 – JD Walton, Rd 3.80
2010 – Eric Olsen, Rd 6.183
2011 – Orlando Franklin, Rd 2.46
2012 – Philip Blake, Rd 4.108
2013 – Vinston Painter, Rd 6.173
Average OL selections per year: 1.67
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.111
Washington OL selections since 2008 (top 5 least sacks):
2008 – Chad Rinehart, Rd 3.96
2010 – Trent Williams, Rd 1.4
2010 – Eric Cook, Rd 7.229
2010 – Selvish Capers, Rd 7.231
2011 – Maurice hunt, Rd 7.217
2012 – Josh LeRibeus, Rd 3.71
2012 – Adam Gettis, Rd 5.141
2012 – Tom Compton, Rd 6.193
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.148
Atlanta OL selections since 2008 (top 5 least sacks):
2008 – Sam Baker, Rd 1.21
2009 – Garrett Reynolds, Rd 5.156
2010 – Mike Johnson, Rd 3.98
2010 – Joe Hawley, Rd 4.117
2011 – Andrew Jackson, Rd 7.210
2012 – Peter Konz, Rd 2.55
2012 – Lamar Holmes, Rd 3.91
Average OL selections per year: 1.17
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.107
San Diego OL selections since 2008 (top 5 least sacks):
2008 – Corey Clark, Rd 7.234
2009 – Louis Vasquez, Rd 3.78
2009 – Tyronne Green, Rd 4.133
2011 – Stephen Schilling, Rd 6.201
2012 – Johnnie Troutman, Rd 5.149
2012 – David Molk, Rd 7.226
2013 – DJ Fluker, Rd 1.11
Average OL selections per year: 1.17
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.147
Detroit OL selections since 2008 (top 5 least sacks):
2008 – Gosder Cherilus, Rd 1.17
2009 – Lydon Murtha, Rd 7.228
2010 – Jason Fox, Rd 4.128
2011 – Johnny Culbreath, Rd 7.209
2012 – Riley Reiff, Rd 1.23
2013 – Larry Warford, Rd 3.65
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.112
New England OL selections since 2008:
2009 – Sebastian Vollmer, Rd 2.58
2009 – Rich Ohrnberger, Rd 4.123
2009 – George Bussey, Rd 5.170
2010 – Ted Larsen, Rd 6.205
2010 – Thomas Welch, Rd 7.208
2011 – Nate Solder, Rd 1.17
2011 – Marcus Cannon, Rd 5.138
Average OL selections per year: 1.17
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.131
NY Jets OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Nate Garner, Rd 7.211
2009 – Matt Slauson, Rd 6.193
2010 – Vlad Ducasse, Rd 2.61
2012 – Robert Grifin, Rd 6.203
2013 – Brian Winters, Rd 3.72
2013 – Oday Aboushi, Rd 5.141
2013 – William Campbell, Rd 6.178
Average OL selections per year: 1.17
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.151
Arizona OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Brandon Keith, Rd 7.225
2009 – Herman Johnson, Rd 5.167
2009 – Trevor Canfield, Rd 7.254
2012 – Bobby Massie, Rd 4.112
2012 - Senio Kelemete, Rd 5.151
2012 – Nate Potter, Rd 7.221
2013 – Jonathan Cooper, Rd 1.7
2013 – Earl Watford, Rd 4.116
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.156
Baltimore OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Oniel Cousins, Rd 3.99
2008 – David Hale, Rd 4.133
2009 – Michael Oher, Rd 1.23
2010 – Ramone Harewood, Rd 6.194
2011 – Jah Reid, Rd 3.85
2012 - Kelechi Osemele, Rd 2.60
2012 – Gino Gradkowski, Rd 4.98
2013 – Ricky Wagner, Rd 5.168
2013 – Ryan Jensen, Rd 6.203
Average OL selections per year: 1.5
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.119
Chicago OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Chris Williams, Rd 1.14
2008 – Chester Adams, Rd 7.222
2008 – Kirk Barton, Rd 7.247
2009 – Lance Louis, Rd 7.246
2010 - J'Marcus Webb, Rd 7.218
2011 – Gabe Carimi, Rd 1.29
2013 – Kyle Long, Rd 1.20
2013 – Jordan Mills, Rd 5.163
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.145
Cincinnati OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Anthony Collins, Rd 4.112
2009 – Andre Smith, Rd 1.6
2009 – Jonathan Luigs, Rd 4.106
2010 – Otis Hudson, Rd 5.152
2010 – Reggie Stephens, Rd 7.228
2011 – Clint Boling, Rd 4.101
2012 – Kevin Zeitler, Rd 1.27
2013 – Tanner Hawkinson, Rd 5.156
2013 – Reid Fragel, Rd 7.240
2013 – TJ Johnson, Rd 7.251
Average OL selections per year: 1.67
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.138
Dallas OL selections since 2008:
2009 – Robert Brewster, Rd 3.75
2010 – Sam Young, Rd 6.179
2011 – Tyron Smith, Rd 1.9
2011 – David Arkin, Rd 4.110
2011 – Bill Nagy, Rd 7.252
2013 – Travis Frederick, Rd 1.31
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.109
Houston OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Duane Brown, Rd 1.26
2009 – Antoine Caldwell, Rd 3.77
2010 – Shelley Smith, Rd 6.187
2011 – Derek Newton, Rd 7.214
2012 – Brandon Brooks, Rd 3.76
2012 – Ben Jones, Rd 4.99
2012 – Nick Mondek, Rd 6.195
2013 – Brennan Williams, Rd 3.89
2013 – David Quessenberry, Rd 6.176
Average OL selections per year: 1.5
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.127
Kansas City OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Brandon Albert, Rd 1.15
2008 – Barry Richardson, Rd 6.170
2009 – Colin Brown, Rd 5.139
2010 – Jon Asamoah, Rd 3.68
2011 – Rodney Houston, Rd 2.55
2012 – Jeff Allen, Rd 2.44
2012 – Donald Stephenson, Rd 3.74
2013 – Eric Fisher, Rd 1.1
2013 – Eric Kush, Rd 6.170
Average OL selections per year: 1.5
Average OL selection location: Rd 3.82
Minnesota OL selections since 2008:
2008 – John Sullivan, Rd 6.187
2009 – Phil Loadholt, Rd 2.54
2010 – Chris DeGeare, Rd 5.161
2011 – Demarcus Love, Rd 6.168
2011 – Brandon Fusco, Rd 6.172
2012 – Matt Kalil, Rd 1.4
2013 – Jeff Baca, Rd 6.296
2013 – Travis Bond, Rd 7.214
Average OL selections per year: 1.33
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.157
New Orleans OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Carl Nicks, Rd 5.164
2010 – Charles Brown, Rd 2.64
2010 – Matt Tennant, Rd 5.158
2012 – Andrew Tiller, Rd 6.179
2012 – Marcel Jones, Rd 7.234
2013 – Terron Armstead, Rd 3.75
Average OL selections per year: 1
Average OL selection location: Rd 5.146
San Francisco OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Chilo Rachal, Rd 2.39
2008 – Cody Wallace, Rd 4.107
2010 – Anthony Davis, Rd 1.11
2010 – Mike Iupati, Rd 1.17
2011 – Daniel Kilgore, Rd 5.163
2011 – Michael Person, Rd 7.239
2012 – Joe Looney, Rd 4.117
2012 – Jason Slowey, Rd 6.199
2013 – Carter Bykowski, Rd 7.246
Average OL selections per year: 1.5
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.126
Tampa Bay OL selections since 2008:
2008 – Jeremy Zuttah, Rd 3.83
2009 – Xavier Fulton, Rd 5.155
Average OL selections per year: .33
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.119
Tennessee OL selections since 2008:
2009 – Troy Kropog, Rd 4.135
2009 – Ryan Durand, Rd 7.239
2011 – Byron Stingily, Rd 6.175
2013 – Chance Warmack, Rd 1.10
2013 – Brian Schwenke, Rd 4.107
Average OL selections per year: .83
Average OL selection location: Rd 4.133
Ok, my first takeway from all of that is how in the world have the Buccaneers only drafted two OL in the past 6 years? Seriously. My second takeaway is that the Dolphins really aren't outside the norm when it comes to the number of OL selected since Ireland took over. The thing that jumps out though is our average selection location of OL. Only 6 other teams are within like 16 picks (Jaguars, Chiefs, Raiders, Seahawks, Texans and Rams) and only 3 of those are higher or equal (Jaguars, Rams ,and Raiders). It seems to me that a big difference between us and other teams is that we don't have any 7th round selections which would offset our average. Now we're obviously taking OL high because we feel we need to look for people who will be starters, but on face value it does seem like our higher average selection is not paying dividends (27th in rushing in the league, most sacked team).
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Stitches likes this.
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Thanks for the research Stitches. I'm really not sure what or who you're looking to defend though. To me, it really doesn't matter that much if the Dolphins are spending more, less or the same as other teams in draft picks and/or $$$ on the OL. What matters is that this unit is not getting it done. We've now had 2 offensive minded coaches (Sparano's specialty was supposed to be offensive line) and nothing has improved. In fact, things have only gotten worse since 2008. There has been one constant factor over that time span, but I won't travel too far down that road.
But this is some great perspective so I hope I don't come off like I'm pooing all over your thread. :up:Stitches likes this. -
Obviously the performance sucks, nothing we do here will change that. Maybe we can see how bad it really is based on what we've spent though, or get some perspective as to what we're paying vs what others have since Ireland has been here.MonstBlitz and maynard like this. -
One problem that I don't think this research will account for is player retention. Only speaking for myself, but I don't see a problem with spending picks, specifically high picks on the offensive line. When a team uses a first round pick on a tackle, you usually hear that followed with a statement or sentiment of, "That guy will anchor the (right/left) side of that line for years to come." When you spend that first round pick, but then are unable to retain that player for a 2nd contract that's a problem. Jake Long not being here, with all his faults, is a big reason why the drop off in O-line play has been so drastic. And if you want to make the argument that Jake Long is no good and Jonathan Martin is playing just as good if not better (which I don't buy) then the question becomes more about talent evaluation than player retention. Pick your poison. This line has been poorly assembled. Mistakes in free agency, player retention, and talent evaluation. It's not one mistake, it's a culmination of mistakes in all 3 areas.
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In the next thread/part I want to deal with FA dollars & contract extensions (which would account for player retention; at least the way I look at it, perhaps not how you would). Again, that part may not determine whether contracts are good or not, just simply data accumulation and comparison.
We can kind of already tell the line is poorly assembled (as things stand, obviously it could get turned around, though we're likely just hoping for mediocre in such a case). I'm just curious if the $ or picks involved can help show that we're paying an unusual amount for this poorness, or if that we're still spending in line with most teams.MonstBlitz likes this. -
Interesting stats but it does not take into account the dismal record of free agent signings ....Incognito notwithstanding.
Who can forget Columbo,Grove and now Clabo .:cry:
Or will that be analyzed in Part 2 ?