This thought has been on my mind all morning.
So I looked up their stats and awards.
Zach Thomas
Brian Urlacher
I got the awards list from wikipedia and the stats from ESPN.
NFL.com does not include stats from the 90s for whatever reason.
I also didnt post awards like Defensive player of the week/month because I didnt think that is relevant towards a HoF vote.
Having one more probowl appearence shouldnt make that much of a difference.
Anyway the advantages I see that Urlacher has is that he has a few Defensive Player of the Year awards, while Zach has none.
Statistically the only advantage Urlacher has is in sacks and INTs. And he barely has more INTS than Zach had.
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Da 'Fins likes this.
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Where's fumble recoveries and TDs?
Also, didn't Urlacher play in a Super Bowl or two? I know he had one for sure. -
The Bears only went to the SB once when Urlacher was there.
AS for FR and TDs. Sorry, had to poop in the middle of typing this. I forgot but here they are:
Urlacher:
16 Fumble Recoveries
ZT:
8 Fumble Revoveries
I think FFs are the more important stat because anyone can fall or pick up a loose ball.
TDs:
ZT: 4
Urlacher: 2.SICK likes this. -
much as I love Zach, I'll take a healthy Urlacher over Zach. problem is health was an issue for Urlacher - so it muddies up the argument.
as far as the awards for both, pretty similar, but at the end of the day, I don't think Zach was ever seriously considered for DPOY, while Urlacher won it. that could easily be the fine line that allows Urlacher in and keeps Zach on the waiting list. -
It's an interesting question.
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Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member
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http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/U/UrlaBr00.htm
scroll down and look at "similiar player" Zach is in every timeframe...these guys are one in the same, some stats here and there slant each others way....but yeah FF Thomas gets in if he does....
Urlacher will have an easier time getting in because and I maybe pessimistic here but he is the darling of the media where for Miami anybody not named Marino isn't.... -
Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member
My heart is with ZT...he was much more dominant in his D's than Urlacher was in his. They are different guys and stats could lie a bit as to how important each was to their respective teams. Zach doesn't have Urlacher's status, but I see ZT ending in the HOF, although not necessarily a first ballot guy...
Heck, I'm still mad Kooch isn't in the HOF....c'mon....All Pro (not just pro bowlers, but All Pro) in 3 different positions along the OL ?? Give me a break...finyank13 likes this. -
So here's the comparison to be made:
All Pro 1st Team: Zach Thomas 5x, Brian Urlacher 4x
All Pro 2nd Team: Zach Thomas 2x, Brian Urlacher 1x
Pro Bowls: Zach Thomas 7x, Brian Urlacher 8x
Championships: Zach Thomas 0x, Brian Urlacher 0x
All Decade Teams: Zach Thomas 1x (2000's), Brian Urlacher 1x (2000's)
Defensive Player of the Year: Zach Thomas 0x, Brian Urlacher 1x
Tackles: Zach Thomas 1733, Brian Urlacher 1358
Turnovers (FF, INT): Zach Thomas 34, Brian Urlacher 34
Touchdowns: Zach Thomas 4, Brian Urlacher 4
Sacks: Zach Thomas 20.5, Brian Urlacher 41.5
Games Started: Zach Thomas 182, Brian Urlacher 180HULKFish, Aquafin, infiltrateib and 4 others like this. -
Not sure if this is a relevant stat, but tackles per game played:
Brian Urlacher - 7.4
Ray Lewis - 8.9
Zach Thomas - 9.4anthony0187, HULKFish, unluckyluciano and 2 others like this. -
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It's my opinion they should both get in, championship or not. They way these guys both played the position, especially Zach for being undersized, they both are worthy. These stats, show just that IMO.Bpk likes this.
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, Sceeto and Frumundah Finnatic like this.
That's the reality. Both of these players should be in.
This is interesting. Some more STATS for the argument. Some guy named @JPStats posted another stat comparison.
Tackles Per Year: Zach Thomas 106.4, Brian Urlacher 93.7, Ray Lewis 103.7
TFLs Per Year: Zach Thomas 8.3, Brian Urlacher 8.6, Ray Lewis 7.6
Stuffs Per Year: Zach Thomas 7.1, Brian Urlacher 7.4, Ray Lewis 7.1
Impact Tackles Per Year: Zach Thomas 17.7, Brian Urlacher 16.1, Ray Lewis 17.6
Ohio Fanatic and ToddPhin like this.
Zach was also defensive rookie of the year, no?
edit: yes, he was
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zach_Thomas#Awards_and_honors
Jt0323 likes this.
That's correct.
But so was Urlacher, evidently. LOL.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...ian-urlacher-retires-20130522,0,5749970.story
Jt0323 likes this.
Pretty eerie how close these two are. I guess my main beef is that Urlacher is being widely considered the a Hall of Fame lock and you don't hear people talk about Zach that way.
anthony0187, seabass0795, brandon27 and 7 others like this.
Zach Thomas wasn't much of a personality. He was a cool guy, however he never was a face of the franchise type of guy.
Jt0323 likes this.
The reality is that won't matter because it's all about who was the best on the field for the longest.
But I do think the story angle ends up playing a part in this and from that standpoint yes the fact that Zach Thomas really had no business being as good as he was and therefore may be one of the most instinctive players to ever play the game at any position...should help. Any superlatives help.
On the other hand you could make the case that physically speaking, Brian Urlacher broke and reset the mold for linebackers in this league. That itself is a good story to help make his case.
ESPN must have the stats wrong, they only have Urlacher listed as having two TDS.
They're probably listing only Interception TDs, of which Urlacher has 2 and Thomas has 4. But Urlacher also has a fumble recovery TD and he scored an offensive TD as well.
Frumundah Finnatic likes this.
Zach Thomas played in 8 playoff games versus 7 playoff games for Brian Urlacher, by the way. That's just in case anyone thinks that Urlacher's teams were generally more successful. They were, in a way. Brian Urlacher's Bears were 110-98 from 2000 to 2012 with 7 playoff games. Zach Thomas' Dolphins and Cowboys were 106-102 from 1996 to 2008 with 8 playoff games.
SICK likes this.
Oh, I think they both have a legit 1st ballot case. I just don't think many pundits will agree with me on the ZT part of it, unfortunately.
What it subconsciously boils down to is, despite an illustrious 13 year career and the leader of five top 5 defenses, Zach Thomas is viewed as inferior to Urlacher simply because Brian was a high 1st round pick with close to HOF type expectations the second he was drafted where as Thomas was a 5th round overachiever. The mentality will remain this way until Zach earns a trip to Canton b/c a HOF honor is strong enough to override their draft status and leave them viewed equally.
Thats great, but those measurables don't change throughout their career.....Zach did just as much as Urlacher with far inferior gifts. But Urlacher will be clamored as a first ballot guy, and no one has spoken of Zach since he retired.
Fin D likes this.
don't get me wrong, i agree with you
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