In 2012, Ryan Tannehill's rookie season, he threw 51 passes of 20+ yards in the air, completed 20 of them (43%), for 671 yards, 3 TDs, and 1 INT. His QB rating for those passes was 98.3.
In 2012, the same season, Brian Hartline was targeted on 25 passes of 20+ yards in the air, or 49% of the passes Tannehill threw of that nature. Hartline caught 11 of those passes, dropped 1, for 421 yards. Hartline caught 63% of the yards Ryan Tannehill threw for on passes thrown at least 20 yards in the air. Obviously Brian Hartline was Ryan Tannehill's downfield target in 2012.
Enter Mike Wallace in 2013. In 2013 and 2014 combined, Ryan Tannehill has thrown 109 passes of 20+ yards in the air, completed 29 (27%), for 971 yards (about 486 per year), 5 TDs, and 8 INTs. His QB rating for those passes is 49.
In 2013 and 2014, Mike Wallace has been targeted on 58 of the 109 passes of 20+ yards in the air Ryan Tannehill has thrown, or 54% of them. Brian Hartline has been targeted on 20 of those passes, or 18% of them. Hartline's involvement in the Dolphins' downfield passing game has dropped from 49% of its targets in 2012, to 18% of its targets in 2013 and 2014 combined.
During that same period of time, Mike Wallace on the other hand has been targeted on 54% of the passes in that phase of the game. I think it becomes clear that, with the replacement of Brian Hartline with Mike Wallace as Ryan Tannehill's primary downfield passing target, Ryan Tannehill's downfield passing game has not improved as may have been expected. In fact it's regressed considerably.
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Yup. The OL going to pot certainly played a large part of it. The more time you have to sit in the pocket the better your chances a guy gets free enough and your QB sees clearly enough.
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edit: conflicting info. some sites say top 10. Still far from "the norm" -
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cuchulainn and Fin-Omenal like this.
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Edit: WADR. You're telling us something that we all know by using the simple eye test, but excluding a ridiculously large amount of context. What or who is it you are trying to blame for what? or what point are you trying to make? A lot of Hartlines catches that year were blown coverages. -
These things should suggest the nature of the problem is primarily with Wallace and not Tannehill.jason8er and Tannephins like this. -
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ToddPhin likes this.
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In other news, Ryan Tannehill's number of yards per target on throws of 20+ yards in the air this year is 9.1. Brian Hartline's number of yards per target on such throws in 2012 was 16.8. If you replace the 2014 downfield targets with the same percentage of targets Hartline accounted for in 2012, and then adjust Tannehill's 2014 numbers in accordance with what Hartline did downfield in 2012, you come up with 171 more passing yards on the year, and Ryan Tannehill's QB rating goes from 93.2 to 94.5, with a corresponding jump in his YPA from 6.9 to 7.2. In other words, if the Dolphins' downfield passing game were as efficient in 2014 (with Wallace as its primary target) as it was in 2012 (with Hartline as its primary target), the pass offense would be playing in a way that's consistent with about 10 wins in a regular season on average. In that sense, Wallace's performance downfield in 2014, in comparison to Hartline's in 2012, could have very well been the difference between not making the playoffs this year and making it.
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ToddPhin likes this.
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ToddPhin likes this.
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Lol this thread again? I'm wary to join in, however I will add one stat that is pretty interesting:
Mike Wallace beyond 20+ yards:
2014: 4 receptions/ 157 total yards, 1 TD, (2 receptions 40+) (so far)
2013: 6/261, 1 TD, (3)
2012: 4/241, 4 TD, (3)
2011: 8/456, 5 TD, (5)
2010: 14/561, 7 TD, (6)
2009: 12/453, 6 TD, (5)
Brian Hartline:
2014: 1/35, 0 TD, (0)
2013: 3/102, 2 TDs, (0)
2012: 10/400, 1 TD, (0)
2011: 7/138, 0 TD, (0)
2010: 2/88, 0 TD, (1)
2009: 2/96, 0 TD, (1)ToddPhin, Fin-Omenal and dWreck like this. -
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Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member
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Mike Wallace: 48/2,129, 24 TDs, (24 receptions 40+ yards)
Brian Hartline: 25/859, 3 TDs, (2 rec 40+)
I like Hartliine and it's a shame that he doesn't fit in Lazor's offense. He runs the comeback better than anybody! However, he is no Mike Wallace when it comes to recieving down the field, especially in passes thrown beyond 40 yards. Obviously stats don't tell the whole story, but I think these easily jive with the eyeball test.roy_miami likes this. -
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It's emberassing that we have people who really think Brian Hartline is a better deep threat than Wallace, it's about as dumb as the Zach Thomas is a Saftey threads of years past.
Sucks but what ya gonna do?? It is a public site.DolphinGreg likes this. -
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