A guy that I've thought would be the perfect mentor for Ted Ginn is Isaac Bruce. I'm glad he reached out to him. Bruce is a guy that I think will help develop Josh Morgan in San Francisco. I hope that one of the guys the organization would look to is Amani Toomer. If he could be brought in, I think it would help the younger guys a lot.

 

The one and only thing I dont like about him is he seems afraid to get hit.. other than that, hes shown to have solid route running and good hands.

 

If we landed amani toomer and nnamdi asomugha i fear the testosterone seeping from alens keyboard to this forum would shut it down...

and i'm glad ginn is doing what he can.

 

a player thats afraid to get hit doesnt take Haloti Ngata head on.

 

Is there any chance ted gets traded this off season? I just don't see the need for Ginn with Bess and camarillo on board.


thoughts?

 

I will refrain from saying anything other than "no."

 

:lol:

 

do we really need 3 small Wr's? what if we draft another Wr who gets less playing time?

 

Bess and Camrillio are not #1 WRs.

 

Ginn can stretch the field thats for sure, I just don't see him as a #1 Wr...I could be wrong.

3rd season should tell us alot.

 

Ginn can learn to do what Camarillo and Bess do, which is run short routes and act as a possession receiver. Camarillo and Bess can't learn how to do what Ginn can, which is stretch a defense vertically and gain the attention of safetys. I see no reason whatsoever to get rid of Ginn. Not that I wouldn't look to upgrade the position, but I would feel comfortable with those three as our WRs next year.

 

What's so funny? :sad:

 

I don't think he's an number one either.

 

Cam will also be coming ff a knee injury, which only gives more reason to keep Ginn.

 

cam and bess are the same kind of receiver. It woud make more sense to trade one of them then to trade Ginn who offers something to the table the other 2 do not.

not to mention the cap hit that would be taken for trading ginn.

 

Just messing with ya.

 

and cam is? Bess i can see how you would think he will develop into a #1 receiver. Cam to me doesn't seem like he doesn't have much upside left, esspecially coming off an ACL tear. Which isn't to see he isn't a solid receiver because he is, but he is more of a #3 in my opinion.

 

I think Camarillo and Bess are capable of gaining attention from Safeties down field by using their head and shoulders to gain separation from the Cornerbacks, much like you see Roddy White doing in Atlanta and Hakeem Nicks at the college level. Ginn is a threat downfield but he's not used as one because of reasons we have gone over numerous times in the past. Camarillo and Bess fit the short routes perfectly and I think the difference between them two and Ginn is that Ginn lacks the concentration.

 

I think Ginn might be the best fit in the slot out of the three. Camarillo is more than a number three in my opinion.

 

what upside does Cam have though? Ginn has improved every facet of his game since coming into the league dramatically and will continue to grow. Is Cam not more of a finished product as he doesn't have the athleticism of Ginn especially coming off an ACL injury which will presumably slow him down quite a bit.

and i would say Bess is the prototrypical slot receiver, extremely quick, good hands and can make linebackers miss but not necessarily very fast.Cam is more of an outside possesion receiver who gets open with his route running but cannot beat many Dbs deep. Ginn is more of a deep threat which doesn't fit the slot as well as Bess.

#3 receiver doesn't mean the receiver is in the slot also. Wes Welker is the #2 receiver for NE but he lines up in the slot i wager to say the majority of the time.

 

I really think Camarillo was the most consistent of the 3.

 

That's fine and dandy but he's no threat. TO drops more balls than a nevada hooker but he's better than our WRs (or was). You need a deep threat. Throw two non-deep threat WRs out there with a non-deep threat QB we have and watch our offense get castrated.

(edited for spelling)

 

Bess is also a rookie and Ginn wasn't looked at very much in the first half of the season.

 

No, but I do think we will Draft another Wr.

 

Great point.

 

what he said. No offense to cam, but in his biggest game of the year, it was when Denver double teamed Ginn essentially every play and played against a DB who played 7 yards back of cam. credit where credit is due to cam for making them pay for it

 

With the medical advances, there won't be much of slowing down with Camarillo, if any. In reference to Camarillo's upside, he's 26 years old and he's a very good route runner and has good hands to go along with pretty good speed. He still has some upside and you point out the continued improvement of Ted Ginn, well why not point out the continued improvement of Greg Camarillo? Your talking about a guy that was on San Diego's practice squad, came here and ran some beautiful routes but is only remembered for a single touchdown he made and was our best receiver this year. He's made tremendous improvements in his game.

I think Davone Bess could be the receiver opposite of Camarillo as he runs good routes and has good hands. You don't have to have 4.3 speed to beat defensive backs deep, again I look to Hakeem Nicks as an example. He sets up the defensive backs by the use of his eyes and his shoulders. He gains separation like that and has beaten defensive backs this year.

I'm aware of that. Camarillo is a number one on this team in my opinion. He's the best receiver in my opinion. Ted Ginn in the slot would be a good move IMO because your getting him to be free coming off the line and you can get him to go to the underneath routes, getting him in open space to make tacklers miss, and possibly hit a homerun. He's a dangerous threat when he has the ball in his hands and I think moving him to the slot would be smart because of the reasons above as well as he wouldn't have DB's draped all over him. Also, without the DB's all over him, he would be more focused on catching the ball instead of getting hammered.

Absolutely agree. He's the best receiver out of the three IMO.

 

i know you can find gems later in the draft(as we did with bess as an UFA) but i don't see Parcells(assuming he stays) using an early round pick on a WR, it just really isn't his style imo. i can them picking up an Armani Toomer or an other solid Vet but i don't expect a big name or an early round draft pick to be used on a WR.

 

I thanked you primarily for the Nevada hooker line. :lol:

 

Would you deny that of the 3 receivers, teh one with the least upside is greg?

Nicks is a college WR. he can turn out to be good or even great but its a different ball game in the pros so i wouldn't start using him as an example on what an NFl receiver should be. I know speed isn't the only thing you need to get sepreation, obviously, but Bess excells in short little routes over the middle where he can turn upfield and make people miss, which is the prime example of a slot receiver imo. For all teh comparisions Greg gets to Welker(for various reasons) Bess' playing style is much more like welker who is the best slot receiver in thegame today and is making a case as being one of the best slot receivers ever.

before Cam's injury Ginn's and Cam's yardage were very comparable.596 and 613 for cam, less than a 20 yard difference, if you want to call cam the #1 receiver than fine but it was by a very slim margin.

I think moving ginn around and lining him up in the slot at times is a good idea, no idea why they do not do it more frequently but of the 3 Bess is the one best utilized in the slot.

Consistently probably. But again who is scared of cam. His biggest game of the opposing team gave him a 10 yard cushion while they doubled ginn to the outside

 

No but I wouldn't say he has no upside, as you said.

I'm not using him as the prototypical NFL wide receiver here, I'm using him as an example of something he does to gain separation. You see what he does throughout the NFL, as I pointed out with Roddy White.

Yes he does but I also think he can be a good outside receiver. I think he could do the same damage on the outside than he does in the slot, which is why I say move Ginn into the slot and Bess outside.

Alright.

Hey, if you can consistently gain separation on routes, you'll put some fear into DC's. He's not Randy Moss out there but he moves the chains, making drives longer and that is killer.

 

another thing i would say is Pennington's limitations hurt ginn more so than Cam or bess. Ginn's greatest gift is his speed and ability to be a deep threat.
even on the plays Ginn goes deep and pennignton hits him, ginn consistently has to slow down and wait for the ball to get there, like the opening throw of the buffalo game.

and roddy white was considered a bust untill his 3rd year in the league. he had 506 receiving yards his 2nd year. and 446 his first. Ginn has 790 receiving yards this year and had 420 his first.
i keep telling people, unless the player isn't even on the field, you cannot judge a player until atleast their 3rd year in the league. particularly receivers and Qbs.

 

Ginn is already a legitimate deep threat he just isn't a NFL #1 WR right now. See the Dolphins don't have the depth at WR or the veterans so he has kinda been forced in the role and it shows that he needs to be developed more.

At Ohio St he was a pure playmaker and deep threat the focus at OSU wasn't to turn him into a possession guy so its kinda like getting a freshman WR. I believe Ted Ginn Jr is going to be a special player just needs time to adjust to the role and learn to be more than a deep threat.

We'll see how much he has changed as a WR next season.

 

Hey Ted want to help yourself and us?

Lift some ****ing weights!

God it is so damn annoying seeing our annorexic WR get pushed around out there for such a stupid reason.

 

what stupid reason? that he doesn't lift weights?