We've seen most of what this team really is at this point. What roster holes do you think need fixing?
Here are my thoughts on whether we are set or have needs at each position...
[I am not making suggestions as to which players to target to fill the holes, just identifying needs at this stage]
Offense
QB: This will be hotly debated. Some feel Tannehill can still be "the guy" while others feel he has shown he will never be more than average. Where I currently see the QB position is that we are in need of a very good QB prospect (not a late rounder) to develop next to Tannehill. I question whether there is enough benefit in holding on to Matt Moore to justify using that QB2 slot on him. For what we pay, Moore needs to either be a good mentor to Tannehill (who is not exactly flourishing) or actually be used when our offense and QB are struggling (but the coaches are too committed to Tannehill, rightly so, to use Moore even as we struggle so there is no real upside to having him on the bench). Clearly the coaches don't see the benefit in letting Moore take the reins. Let Moore go. At this point, I'd rather see a different QB brought in to compete with Tannehill. If he is a leader, with confidence in himself, and true ability then he will win the head-to-head competition and earn the starting role over the next couple years.
RB: I think we will re-sign Miller, who has ability. Ajayi needs more seasoning late this season. With our newfound commitment to running the ball, we will see enough of Ajayi by season's end that I believe we let Damien Williams go. That said, I think there is still room for a power back or bigger back on the roster. A guy like Devon Johnson would be cool, but I wouldn't use a high pick, especially after giving Miller a payday.
TE: A position of need. Cameron is simply not gelling with Tannehill or this Offense (sorry FFG, his looks don't do it for me). Dion Sims has shown less that I'd hoped at this stage. It's hard to assess the style of TE (h-back, receiving, balance,d power-blocking) we'd lean towards with no clue of the coaching staff or offensive system for next year, but I definitely think we need a TE who produces in the offense. It's critical for us to raise our PPG.
WR: We are pretty good here if we head into next season with Parker outside, and Stills/Landry alternating slot and outside roles. Add Hazel and a late round or UDFA WR pick and we will have enough to field a decent squad. Jennings and Matthews do not return, imo. A shame we wasted Matthews while he was here.
C: We're good at Center with Pouncey. Would be nice to pick up a guy with developmental talent at C/G.
OG: Big hole. Two holes, in fact. Will Turner develop? Maybe. will Jalil develop? Maybe. I've seen enough of Dallas Thomas. Time to add a good solid late-first round, early second round pick at Guard. Plus a mid-late rounder.
OT: Clearly Albert is a massive injury risk. James is now a slight injury risk as well. Clearly the offense suffered once both went down. I think you have to invest in an OT here. First rounder, possibly, depending what's on the board. It makes no sense to have a $100m QB getting shellshocked back there so you can save a couple million on the O-line.
Defense
DT: Suh and Phillips are here for awhile. I could do without Mitchell at this point. Mosely would be welcome only if cheaper, imo. Not a roster hole, but we do need a rotational guy.
DE: Big need. OV has holes in his game and I doubt we open our wallets to keep him. Wake is clearly on the decline physically, in that he cannot give you 100% performance 1005 of the time. You either limit his snaps or he tires or breaks. We need a pass rusher with some heft and ballast that can also hold the point of attack against the run. Shelby can do this decently, though lacks Pro Bowl type talent. Re-sign Shelby. Getting an elite, talented pass rusher / ruun defending DE is a high priority. We've seen what happens when we can't stop the run to one side of the field, and when we cannot pressure the QB and our weak CB corps is exposed Which brings us to...
CB: Oi vey. Grimes was the only reliable one, but since he started battling injury he's been vulnerable. He's aging and no one has stepped up behind him. This is a weak unit, and we need a shutdown corner. Bowman, Taylor, Brice McCain are not the answer. I hold out hope that Bobby McCain can develop. But CB is definitely a high priority.
S: Rashad jones is a damn stud. No question. Thrilled we have him. But next to him is a hole. Delmas will not return after this latest injury. Aikens has looked wobbly. Thomas is meh, and more comfortable at CB, it appears, plus he is a FA if I am not mistaken. Who does that leave? Kovacs? No thanks. Add Safety to our list of needs.
OLB: Jenkins, Misi, McCain between them have a good OLB in the bunch, but this is a weak unit. Even so, it's not a priority imo. We are in more need at...
MLB: We need a much better player here to take this defense to the next level. A playmaker. A guy who can cover, who can stuff the run, who can flow sideline-to-sideline, who is smart and can read the plays and line up the defense, who can occasionally blitz and destroy a play in the backfield or get a sack. I'd say this is a definite need.
K: Need competition for Franks.
P: Not a high need. Darr is fine, but sure, bring in a UDFA punter and let them boot that thing around.
KR/PR: Still want an electrifying guy here. Perhaps when we stock the cupboard at CB this offseason we can find one who is a great returner.
I'd group the needs in the following order of priority:
URGENT PRIORITY
CB, DE, OG, TE, MLB
HIGH PRIORITY
OT, S, OLB, young QB
MEDIUM PRIORITY
rotational DT, rotational RB, Kicker competition
It's a LOT of needs, unfortunately.
[While we are at it, on the coaching staff I'd like to see a new QB coach, new OL coach, new OC, new DC]
What do you think we need?
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Disnardo, Shane Falco, number21 and 10 others like this.
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Good write up Bpk and I agree with most of it. However imo currently, LB is the biggest need on D. We get gut punched just about every game b/c of this unit. We need two new playmaking starters & perhaps have Jelani and the youngsters compete for the last spot.
keypusher, dolphin25, cbrad and 1 other person like this. -
I agree. The concern I have is that we are looking at at least five urgent holes at starting positions, plus another 3-4 high priority needs. That's a lot of holes to fill for starters in one draft and free agency. You're lucky if two draft picks become starters in a given year. And let's say you sign four potential starters through Free Agency, generally about half of them seem to have a good year after that. So if we get 2 good starters out of the draft (which may be optimisitic, but doable) and two decent starters out of free agency, it will still leave us with four poorly performing starting positions.
More holes in the bottom of the canoe than fingers to plug them. -
it doesn't matter what we need if we get another **** coaching staff that can't coach. you can have an all star team and with coaches like we've had it'll still be crap. And tannebaum ran the jets into the ground so. I have no hope of getting any sort of decent coaching staff.
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That's a well-thought post, but unfortunately you're letting our front office logic get the better of you when it comes to QB. As you just said, our receivers are solid, we're stocked at RB and the line needs a few upgrades. So by process of elimination, that points to the quarterback. That should be the top priority this off-season, which is why we desperately need to evaluate Moore these last four games before letting him walk. He's probably better than anything we can pick up off the street and a rookie only guarantees two more lethargic years under Tannehill.
But guess what? We're probably not going to do it because the front office doesn't see QB as a problem....even though we're one of the lowest scoring offenses in the entire league. Or the worst on 3rd down. Or the worst in the red zone. And while we certainly have other holes to fill, none of them are as gaping wide as the QB position. So hopefully our front office comes to their senses and stops the bleeding once and for all.dolphin25 likes this. -
The line needs a FEW upgrades? You say that so casually.
It's way worse than that. All of our guards are either terrible or so-so at best. Albert and James are fine, but we've gotten maybe 12 games in two seasons with both of them on the field at the same time. Our backup Ts need upgrading.Fox is terrible. We roughly need about 3 or 4 new lineman. It won't happen because, unfortunatly, I think the front office dismisses OL the same way you just did.Pandarilla and resnor like this. -
I am not as upset (at the moment) about it as you, but it's an absolute must that we get a coaching staff, top to bottom, that makes the best use of this roster. We cannot fill all our roster needs through player acquisiton alone. That means we need the coaches to:
- Do a better job at the Position coaching level to get the most out of the players we DO have and help them perform well and develop
- Do a better job at the Co-ordinator level to put these players in a position to succeed and maximize their abilities due to scheme, gameplan, rotational choices and play-calling -
I think the right OL coach who is completely in sync with the right OC would ameliorate the OL issues quite a bit. A new guard and a young talented OT plus a new OC who gets to choose his own OL coach could create a fast turnaround. Perhaps throw a mid-level vet guard in there to help teach the youngin's
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I completely agree. That's 3 new guys, though. That's a third of the entire unit. And we'd still be hoping turner/douglas improve.
It's a huge problem of this team. -
What do you do when you have eight attackers and four bullets in the gun.
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I didn't dismiss anything. Statistically, our offensive line is 18th in overall protection, yet our QB is dead last in 3rd down conversions and many other critical stats. So yes, the line does need attention...but nowhere near what the QB position needs.gunn34 likes this.
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you have to look at 3rd down as a whole and not just throw it on one player. we usually cant run so that's 3rd and long... our playbook doesn't have much in way of route running past 4 yards, so even if tannehill completes it the gain is minimal, so that's more 3rd and long. Lastly we can't go 2 plays without a penalty on offense, so that is more 3rd and long. I'd imagine to bet the dolphins have the most yards to gain on 3rd downs out of the whole league. None of that is putting the players in a place to succeed. (note: this isn't giving a pass to tannehill on 3rd down, this is saying look at the **** as a whole)
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Because we do **** like this
http://i.imgur.com/KOsFU2s.gif
Look at this play. It's a designed pass on 3rd and 3 to the rb. Theres no time for reading, its a quick throw. Wrs clear out the left side, RB swings out. The play, against a zone, has absolutly no ****ing chance. Tannehill, at the time, could not audible. He has to run this play knowing the RB is never going to get the first down.
And its been like this all season. It's why lazor is unemployed now.Rocky Raccoon, muskrat21 and bran like this. -
exactly, it also sucks since if tannehill on that play was allowed to read the defense, protection held up well and it looks like a receiver was open(landry?) for huge yards, but instead the design of the play was to go the running back which the corner reads like a book and had zero chance to succeed. yeah getting rid of lazor is good but the system is still the same and yesterday there was plenty of lazor in a lot of the playcalling yesterday, the only difference was we kept running the ball whereas with lazor miller would have had 8 carries.
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How is that not an easy read? The CB is directly in line-of-sight with the RB swinging out. If he is there, it's a zone and Tannehill should be looking across the middle for the WR in motion. That is a great example of a QB that doesn't do a good job of processing information quickly and responding accordingly.
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It's a non read play. He throws the ball within a second of it hitting his hands. It's an atrocious playcall, one that reeks of chip Kelly's style. It was called to get the RB in space. Lazor basically called his offense as if the ballcarrier was going to beat the guy in front of him every single time. This is a perfect example of that.
Tannehill just does what he's coached to do. Now if you want to argue that he should say "**** the playcall", well thats different -
The only real hope is, of course, the sale of the team.
Mosley is already gone.
I like Mark Dantonio or Mike Shula for coach. Absolutely hate the Saints coach. I wouldn't trade a pair of worn out shoes for him.
Reality check......Tannehill is a bad QB. Jordan Cameron is a good TE, and our receiving corps is excellent. Tannehill should be traded to the next delusional victim. There will be a plethora of veteran QB's available in FA next year. All much cheaper than Tannehill. Get a pick for Tannehill and sign a stopgap/mentor Vet QB.
Carson Wentz is the future. The future.....not next year as a rookie transitioning from a small school. You can watch him in the 2016 Senior Bowl.
Pouncey is the leader of our OL and he is a moron. He is enormously overrated and should be traded to whoever is stupid enough to offer high compensation. Alex Mack is opting out and will be a FA in March. He is the real All Pro, Dolphins should sign him to lead the OL. This entire OL should be replaced by the beginning of the 2017 season.
Grimes is finished. Probably untradable but I would like to get a 6th for him. Dolphins need!!! an elite CB, and if McCain and Lippett develop into quality CB's then, Yahoo. Looks like we will be drafting too high to get a shut down CB in the draft.
Trade Down and add picks if possible and then draft Kendall Fuller in the 2nd. Maybe Jamar Taylor will mature enough to be a quality backup. I like CB Adiarius Barnes as a super sleeper late.
If the Dolphins run a 3-4 under the new coaches next year it may be necessary to draft a big DE like Deforest Buckner in the 1st round.
Dolphins really need Vincent Rey to hit FA. He could play an awesome Will or Mike in a 3-4. Misi would be traded of course, and I'm not sold on Jelani Starting. He may just be a rotational guy. I like Joshua Perry LB in the 2nd.
Spencer Drango Baylor,Joe Haeg NDSU, Alex Lewis Nebraska,and Harvard's Toner to be the future on the OL.
Matt Dobson super sleeper at FS.
Sign FA Haloti Gnata and dominate.
Dolphins can easily clear cap with the release or trade of Grimes,Pouncey,Misi,Mitchell,Brice McCain,Greg Jennings,Fox,etc....along with the restructuring of Suh,Jordan Cameron, and an extension for Reshad Jones with a low 2016 cap hit. -
I say go defense and fix the OL through Free Agency. I want a MLB and a CB in a perfect world (not counting QB)
MLB, CB, OLB that can pass rush and open field tackle. -
Hey! That's the play people were criticizing Tannehill for! You can't use that for anything but proof of how dumb Tannehill is.
Also, the line needs a few players, so it automatically means QB is the biggest need? If argue we don't have any NFL caliber guards, so that's two positions, and you can't count on Albert, so that's three positions. So, we need starter quality players fire the fifths of our line. But let's chase a QB. I guess if that's your plan, but do you really think there's a QB in this draft to throw the farm for? I think I'd prefer to get a solid line in there, and shore up the defense. I would like to see someone to compete with Tanne, but I don't know that I want to use a high pick for a QB this draft.Shane Falco likes this. -
Is it? Because in the one game where Tannehill COULD audible, it was his worst showing of the season.
Did you ever think that we designed a 3rd and 3 play with a force to the RB because that's all the coordinators had faith in Tannehill to do? His "talent" is in his arm strength; his "weakness" is in processing information quickly enough. And when he was given the chance to prove himself, we had one total drive on the day. That's misleading as well though because it was basically one pass after a few good runs.
For that matter, why would Campbell want to make this a run team? Why has he flat-out said that his QB is nothing more than a game-manager that can't be expected to lead big drives? There are clues EVERYWHERE that point to this organization having zero faith in Tannehill except for our fan-boy owner and a few in the front office. That's why we design those weak-*** plays; it's our only hope with Tannehill behind center.dolphin25 likes this. -
Losing Delmas was huge. We need a savvy veteran free agent.
Hopefully the next coach can retain Dion Jordan and put him at LB.
Fix the o-line and play a more pro style offense. Let's get some behemoths on the line who can really anchor.
Don't reach for anyone in the draft. Doesn't sound very strong from what I'm reading. Perfectly happy with best offensive lineman available in the first.
losing Clay for Cameron has proven to be the biggest mistake. Cameron is likely a cap casualty. Get a good blocking TE, because our Wr's and Rb's can catch really well. Maybe even just use another O-lineman.
Take a shot at a qb late in the draft...never hurts
Finally, be patient. The season isn't even over and we just beat a team that has given us fits for 8 years. Yet, still everyone is seemingly running for their torches and pitchforks. We've got a lot of quality talent on the roster and some promising youngsters. We're finally done with Philbin and we should realize that we should all just step back and see what unfolds. The redundant arguments on Tannehill are just that, redundant. You might be right but you still sound like a spoiled, whiny crybaby when repeated ad nauseum.SuhMe likes this. -
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so, you going to ignore the 2 season with sherman that allowed audibles and tannehill destroyed teams that blitz under that... the 2 best season tannehill had were under sherman and a system that allowed audibles. but you're going to point to one game to say tannehill can't handle it, instead of the 32 other ones that says he can. one game with the coffee guy being the OC but you're going to focus on tannehill... I'm not saying he isn't to blame, but you are refusing to look at the whole picture, you are focusing on one thing and ignoring everything else.
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vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member
So for all the people who say Tannehill is a horrible bad QB.
What happens if we get a coach like Hue Jackson and the new coach decided he disagrees with your evaluation of the QB? Does that make him a bad coach? Is the new coach required to believe Tannehill is a bad QB in order to be a good enough HC for the Dolphins? -
I have seen wide open receivers a lot. When they show wide angle aerial views, almost always there are open receivers on the field. I can not understate how important coaching is in these situations. watching game film also is huge.
I can not say with certainty but it seems as if the plays are dumbed down and Tannehill seems to already know where he is going with the ball. If this is the case - shame on the coaching for not allowing Tannehill to just play. I can not imagine at this level Tannehill doesn't "get it". Why the giant contract if that is where he is at. Something is a miss and I for one don't believe it is Tannehill. Culmination of a lot of factorsresnor likes this. -
Huh?
What does that even mean? Whoever our new HC is will be married to Ryan for the 2016 season??
If he is to be retained the following year he will need to play alot better than he has to this point. Not sure what you are getting at.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkSceeto likes this. -
I'm starting to fear this as well. Although, it is strange that if if he is afraid of the rush, that he takes as many hits as he does.
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Seeing the field, and anticipation, can be aided with better coaching and preparation IMO to an extent anyways. That's of course, assuming he's not shell shocked on the field. If it's the later that's causing the problem... then we're ****ed. If it's not, then there's still a chance. He doesn't often give the impression he's Carr on the field. Which I think is why a lot of people feel that a HC and strong OC & QB coach, can help, or why some at least feel you have to try since you're still tied to him until at least 2017.
What I fear in all of this, is the HC candidate we really want, gets told he's forced to work with Ryan. We can't do that. If the HC you really, really want, doesn't believe he's the guy, but you believe the HC is the guy... then you've got a decision to make.
If the new HC doesn't believe in RT, but is willing to work with him because of that contract for a year, under the premise you're going to let him pick his own QB if it doesn't work out, that's ultimately the best case scenario IMO. Especially if you think you've identified the right man for the HC spot who can create a system, and a culture of winning. At some point, we've got to realize we just can't keep trading coaches and systems in and out and expecting success. Most of the top teams in the NFL are stable in that regard, and it helps everyone, at every position on the field.
It's going to be an interesting offseason, that's for sure.2socks, Bumrush, Bpk and 1 other person like this. -
So we won but they point to stats saying it was a bad game. However when he has a statistically good game and we lose, the stats don't matter?
Got it! I am starting to follow this.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPiston Honda, muskrat21, Rocky Raccoon and 2 others like this. -
I'm not ignoring anything...just look back at those two "golden seasons" and how he self-destructed in December....or how the defense carried us through the "good games" where he managed to put up 20 total points. Heck, Tannehill didn't have a 4th quarter comeback win until season 3...it took almost 40 games before he could string together one drive to win a football game...yet the pro-Tannehill fans ignore all of those problems to see what they want to see. It's like all those strip sacks, tipped passes, inaccurate throws and poor decisions didn't happen in your reality....yet they're on tape just the same.
But here are a few stats that tell the entire story-
- He's bottom 5 in the league in the 4th quarter
- He's in the bottom 5 in December
- He's the worst QB in the league on 3rd down
- He's a bottom 5 QB in the red zone
- He's the worst in QB sacks
- He's the worst in QB fumbles
- He's the worst in escaping pressure
- He's the worst in yards per attempt
- He's the worst in tipped passes
That is the "whole picture" my friend...and it can't be ignored any longer. The 7-5 Seahawks have the WORST line in football by a wide margin this season; Wilson has been pressured 58 times more than Tanehill...yet folks want to say our problem is solely on the line. That excuse just doesn't work anymore though...not after four years of locking on targets and not being able to throw for a first down. Ryan Tannehill just doesn't have the skill-set to lead a football team, and it's beyond my comprehension how anyone could say otherwise at this point. -
vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member
The difference between drafting a QB in round 1 vs 3 or 4 -
Didn't he have a couple of 4th quarter come backs as a rookie?
EDIT: He had one 4th quarter comeback as a rookie and four in his second year, per this site: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=TannRy00Piston Honda likes this. -
Success in the NFL often comes down to the QB-HC duo. When we fired Philbin, we thought we had the Qb side taken care of and just needed a new HC. Oops.
We have neither a HC or a QB good enough to make this team consistent contenders. We can talk other positions, guys we feel good about, whatever. But this team isn't going anywhere until the HC-QB issue is resolved. Until those 2 are in place, the rest is null. -
Here's my outlook on replacing tannehill.
This team has bigger problems. In the first round I'm hoping for a stud LB. The issue where I 100% disagree is the idea of taking a qb in the 2nd or 3rd rounds. We don't need a backup QB more than we need, say a new G, or Cb, or FS. The first half of the season with Delmas last year, Delmas was the guy controlling our defense. We need that back, badly.
I could go on for days about the oline, but let's just say taking a backup QB over oline help would infuriate me.
The qbs in this draft are pretty much all question marks. There is no manning or luck in this draft. I'm not convinced any of the guys, where were picking, will step in and take the job from ryan. Drafting one then would be a waste of a resource this roster so badly needs.
If I'm being truly harsh, imo this defense needs almost all new CBs. (Grimes has aged, I don't even see him as very good anymore.) The lack of a good FS has really burned us both last year and this year.
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