"But...we outgained them 375-104" and other myths

"padre31 wrote:

Day after, and we have all heard the lament from Jets Fans:

"We outplayed them, we outgained them 375 to 104"

Well, in a typical box score, "sure" however as Tony Sparano says "Hidden Yardage", in which we equaled the Jets.

Ted Ginn 299 yds on returns

Jason Taylor 49 yds on a return

52 yds rushing

That would equal: 504 total yards

Hidden yardage does not show up in the typical box score, neither does penalties that take points off the board ala the 2pt conversion that was called back due to illegal motion.

Vontae Davis's Int on the two point conversion does count as an Int, merely a missed conversion try and no different than a missed PAT.

The plain fact is, "no" they did not outplay the Dolphins, the way the NFL approaches statistics simply does not reflect what happened in either a "Hidden Yardage" sense nor a true reflection of the turnovers that happened.

It's obvious their gameplan revolved around stacking the line of scrimmage with 9 or more players....they apparently focused more on that than any other part of the game, that's why they are so upset. Problem is, success is not measured by one aspect of the game.

Ginn is also quieting his critics.

Im not going to pass judgment on this kid yet, but this IS what he was drafted for.

I was thinking about this last night and was going to post this morning, you beat me to it :tongue2:, anyways the NFL really does drop the ball on the stats. Jest fans have to eat the loss, and take a big dose of STFU. Every member here knows that feeling, we have to go back no further then the colts game.

Bottom line Dolphins had 2 possesions in the 4th (I don't count the V formation) and they went 70 yards for a touchdown on one of them...we closed they didn't..their O had the ball with time and goal to go again we closed and they didn't..yardage against prevent and a short field score due to bess's muff color me unimpressed.

GO DOLPHINS! GO TED GINN!
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I will take those 375 to 104 type stats every time as long as we keep winning.

excellent point padre

As much as some hate Ginn for his lack of WR prowess, they sure love him for his return ability. Whether or not he has or will live up to his #9 pick overall status, he's helping us win games. The fact is that on both long returns, he was bottled up and the jests missed the tackles, then his speed took over from there. It was discouraging in the first half where our starting position was inside the 25 for 5 of 7 possessions. At any rate, the bottom line is the score card. This is the first game we've played that we should have lost and won this season. Last season we had quite a few of these types of games.

There is more to stats than the final score though. The jests outplayed us and seemed to overlook the potential on our STs. Well, they paid for that oversight. If I'm Sparano, I'm not overjoyed at our win though. I'm worried about how to slow the Cheatriots now. They are too well a coached team to lose a game they aren't outplayed in...

Let them whine. The fans and players of the Jets are all alike. Special teams and defense are part of the game just as much as the offense is. We scored 3 touchdowns in the third quarter with special teams and defense, our offense wasn't on the field to gain yardage. We beat them again, this time in their house in a different fashion. We own them.

"Rocky Raccoon wrote:

Let them whine. The fans and players of the Jets are all alike. Special teams and defense are part of the game just as much as the offense is. We scored 3 touchdowns in the third quarter with special teams and defense, our offense wasn't on the field to gain yardage. We beat them again, this time in their house in a different fashion. We own them.

Absolutely agree. There is offense, defense, and SPECIAL TEAMS! And good point about offense not being on the field to gain any yardage, and our defense being on the field more to give up yardage -- all due to special teams scores. Had we not scored on those returns, I'm sure the offensive yardage would have been more, and the defensive yardage allowed would have been less, for no other reason than just opportunities.

I was thinking the same thing. They are saying that they totally dominated us, but in reality, nothing is further from the truth.

In the first half, both teams were relatively equal, and the defenses did all the work on both sides. They had the ball less than two mins more than us, and if not for a drive extended by the V. Davis PI call, everything most likely would have looked the same.

It's the second half where they "dominated" the Phins, but they never had the ball. The Dolphins ran 6 offensive plays in the third, taking less than three mins off the clock. That's because every time the Jets had the ball and scored, their special teams would allow Ted Ginn to run it back (or they would fumble....) Then when the Phins did get the ball at the end of the third, they held it into the Fourth and scored a TD the longest (time wise) drive of the game.

After that, the Dolphins did what everyone hates they do. They played to hold a lead instead of driving the steak, but with a lead, no one can really blame them. The defense stepped up on the final drive and stopped them on 4th down from the Dolphins 15 yard line to win the game.

"Zeke0123 wrote:

Bottom line Dolphins had 2 possesions in the 4th (I don't count the V formation) and they went 70 yards for a touchdown on one of them...we closed they didn't..their O had the ball with time and goal to go again we closed and they didn't..yardage against prevent and a short field score due to bess's muff color me unimpressed.

GO DOLPHINS! GO TED GINN!
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This

Because we scored 2 ST TDs, 1 D TD, and our Defense couldn't stop the Jets in the 2nd half, our Offense was on the field for like 5 minutes. Of course we're not gonna put up gaudy stats.

I'm pretty sure we outgained them on Offense in the first half.

Well, as long as the JETS continue to think that a scoring defense and special teams are not part of the game.........those outcomes will probably continue for them.

the NY media and their fans wont put up with that team's whinning for much longer.

i've never seen such unprofessionalism as I've seen in the Jets following these two losses. it's incredible. it's almost like they want to be really hated by everyone.

Counting JTs 48yd return we only had 470 yards in the game.

We had 52 rushing yards, 52 passing yards, 19 PR yards, and 299 KR yards.

Not sure where the other 30 some yards came from that you put into 504?

"Stitches wrote:

Counting JTs 48yd return we only had 470 yards in the game.

We had 52 rushing yards, 52 passing yards, 19 PR yards, and 299 KR yards.

Not sure where the other 30 some yards came from that you put into 504?

Looking at the box scores from nfl.com (Dolphins vs. Jets):

Dolphins Jets
Net Passing: 112 265
Rushing: 52 127
Fumble Returns: 48 0
Kick Returns: 299 115
Punt Returns: 16 45
______________________________________________________

Totals: 527 552

Wasn't that much of a difference at all. Many are quick to dismiss the KR yards as "yeah but", as if those shouldn't count in the overall assessment of who "should have" won the game, but you have to remember, if Ginn doesn't run those back all by himself, that's two more possessions for the Phins Offense, and if they wind up scoring a TD, then all but about 40 yards would have been shifted to the passing or rushing column. Bottom line, get into the opponents end zone. If you can do on one play instead of 8, that's just gravy, because the score board is all that counts. After the Colts game, we, of all teams, should have learned that lesson.

It is important to note that the jets traded their best special-teamer to the Browns in the Braylon Edwards trade. Ignore the special teams at your own peril.

This may be an odd point to make but I think to a degree the biggest part of the reason the Jets were able to score 21 points on three consecutive drives was because of our returns. Our defense must have been working with jelly for legs because with each jet score we made a return just to send the defense back onto the field.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't trade any of those returns, but I don't think the Jets really did as much as they think they did.

How sweet was it to see Larry Izzo really eat a big load of air on that 2nd return, I personlly have never forgiven him for that NE crap he pulled several years ago...come to think of it, I need that in a gif.....anyone?

"StLouisFinFan wrote:

Looking at the box scores from nfl.com (Dolphins vs. Jets):

Dolphins Jets
Net Passing: 112 265
Rushing: 52 127
Fumble Returns: 48 0
Kick Returns: 299 115
Punt Returns: 16 45
______________________________________________________

Totals: 527 552

Wasn't that much of a difference at all. Many are quick to dismiss the KR yards as "yeah but", as if those shouldn't count in the overall assessment of who "should have" won the game, but you have to remember, if Ginn doesn't run those back all by himself, that's two more possessions for the Phins Offense, and if they wind up scoring a TD, then all but about 40 yards would have been shifted to the passing or rushing column. Bottom line, get into the opponents end zone. If you can do on one play instead of 8, that's just gravy, because the score board is all that counts. After the Colts game, we, of all teams, should have learned that lesson.

We ended up with 52 total passing yards, not 112. Henne passed for 112 yards, but all the sacks lost 60 yards. We didn't have 527 total yards.

Which coach was it that said the quickest way to make a team better is special teams, so you target that first?

Man we could have gained another 100 yards is Smith doesn't alligator chop that gift wrapped INT.

I'm happy we won!!!

The first play of most drives begins with the yardage you get on the kick or punt....we just happened to have 2, one play drives of a 100 yards. Count it....the scoreboard did

Somebody call up Rex, and tell him that the game is decided in the "points scored" category, not the "total yards gained" category :chuckle: