I think maybe we need a good discussion about how good/not good Egnew is doing. It seems to be a really hotly debated item on other boards but not so much here.
Personally, I think Egnew is the biggest official casualty of Hard Knocks' super in depth analscope. The Hard Knocks cameras are everywhere, and the NFL Films people like storylines, and an intriguing storyline is a 3rd round pick that had coaches scratching their heads at times.
I've heard everything about Egnew at this point. He's a bust because he can't catch a ball to save his life. He's a bust because he has a blank face while getting yelled at. I guess if he practiced a good pirate face while being yelled at, he wouldn't be a bust. He's a bust because he doesn't get separation in single coverage. He's a bust because he forgot to block for a wide receiver after the receiver caught the ball while Egnew was running routes. He's a bust because Mike Sherman said he'd cut him during a yell session.
The ironic part to me is that if not for the Hard Knocks cameras it's clear to me that most people would watch the preseason games and think that Egnew is having a so-so camp, or maybe even a good camp.
They'd see the plays where his obvious size and athleticism make him an intriguing target up the seam. They'd see him getting open. They'd see him competently blocking defensive ends in both the run and in pass protection, surprisingly well. They'd see him level that DB in the Carolina game. They'd see him make a SUPERB catch on a tipped ball as he was going to the ground for a big 31 yard gain. They'd see him make another catch in traffic, and a nice catch on a ball that was placed poorly around his knees.
But they'd also see the two drops. They would also see him have some poor blocking plays. I very much doubt that many people here or elsewhere could point out the play where Dan Campbell yelled at Egnew for not blocking, unless they had a heads up about it. But there were others. One play in particular Egnew is in the backfield lead blocking for Lamar Miller like a fullback (not his strong suit, you can imagine) and Egnew was too hesitant. Miller ran up behind him, reached out his hand and pulled the Brendan Fraser/Matt Damon maneuver from School Ties.
I think the conclusion would be, he has ups, he has downs, he shows flashes, he makes mistakes...he's a rookie. That would be the conclusion in my honest opinion.
But because Mike Sherman yelled and because he doesn't lacks a pirate face, people are legitimately talking about him being cut.
Let me share with you a play that might have helped him stem this overwhelming tide of negative attention. It was a play at the end of the Tampa Bay game.
My initial read on the play was that Egnew got a step on Jacob Cutrera the linebacker, but that Devlin put the ball too low and I'm not sure why Devlin chose a low heater to his tight end in the back of the end zone like he's throwing to Denarius Moore, rather than a high ball which is more typical when you're throwing to a tight end in the back of the end zone.
The controversy stems once again from Hard Knocks. On initial viewing in real time it's not necessarily crystal clear that Cutrera knocked this ball away. And during Hard Knocks, immediately after the play they showed either someone up in the booth or maybe down on the field, I forget their exact words but whoever it was essentially treated it like a drop. They were clearly frustrated with Egnew on the play.
After examining the play very closely, I come to the same conclusion on that end zone play that I originally had on first viewing. Michael Egnew clearly had a step on Jacob Cutrera the linebacker, as he crossed the back of the end zone. However, Jacob Cutrera has 4.6 speed in his own right and as Egnew drifted his depth to the back of the end zone looking for the jump ball, this created an angle that allowed Cutrera to make up about half a step.
Even so, if the ball is placed correctly, this is a touchdown. Because it wasn't, Cutrera was able to slap it away.
That's the initial view which emphasizes that Egnew had a step on Jacob Cutrera. Below you'll see the final frame.
As you can see, I've captured the exact moment when Jacob Cutrera's outstretched hand got between the ball and Michael Egnew, slapping it away.
What you're seeing in that final picture is that Egnew had plenty of space in front of him. There was a safety in front of him but he was not close enough to threaten Egnew even if he jumped for the football. The safety was not a threat.
Michael Egnew had floated to the back of the end zone expecting a high ball as is most often the case with a tight end, as opposed to a wide receiver. The problem is Pat Devlin did not place the ball high. He placed the ball at chin level. The optimal placement would have been high and to the front of Michael so that he could use his significant leaping skills (37.5 inch vertical, 11'3" broad jump) to go up and get it.
The thing is, if Pat Devlin places that ball correctly (something Egnew couldn't control), there is no talk about cutting Michael Egnew. There is no talk about him being a bust.
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That ball definitely wasn't where it should have been.
I don't buy all this talk about cutting him. They couldn't have expected him to be producing much at this point. From what I see, he just seems like a guy whos head is spinning a little bit. When you make a couple of ordinary rookie mistakes, you can end up putting more pressure on yourself, and it will snowball. I'm not expecting much from him early, but I think he should flash more as the season progresses.DOLPHAN1 likes this. -
dolfan22 Season Ticket Holder Club Member
Great photo and that ball certainly could have been placed in a spot that would have allowed only Egnew to be able to get a hand(s) on it.
FWIW , I was listening to Joe Rose with Ben Volin last night and he thinks Egnew is very stiff and doesn't see a lot to offer hope. Of course Egnew was a pick that needed some time to learn and adapt from his Missouri days , and he may just be doing that.ckparrothead likes this. -
Secondary side effect: the "young Tony Romo" isn't criticized for his ball placement here.
ckparrothead likes this. -
dolfan22 Season Ticket Holder Club Member
From that capture it also looks like Devlin had pretty solid protection.
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Not concerned about Egnew's hands personally, and he seems to get open well enough for a rookie TE. Only concern is blocking, but then again how much blocking will the TE be expected to do in this offense (in-line or from the FB position; not worried about him when he's split out or just down field)? How much will Egnew for that matter to be expected to block when he gets in (assuming he gets in mostly on packages that don't have just one TE)?
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I think we can also add that regardless of what certain coaches may have said that got highlighted on hard knocks, there is zero chance of Ireland, Gaine etc. cutting a third round pick with that kind of athletic ability after one camp. Such a situation is also a good example of why having a GM with some distance from the players allowing greater objectivity is a really good thing, regardless of whether Ireland is any good or not in the role.
I think Egnew could actually really benefit from the approach Jim Turner suggested for Jerry - don't back off the reps, give him more, don't give him time to over think things, just keep the reps and playtime coming. -
It has nothing to do with Hard Knocks as the reason I am down on him. With as much footage as they shoot you are going to get shots of everyone screwing up. For me it's the game play. Honestly if you have a receiving TE who can't catch what good is he? You can be the most athletic guy out there but that doesn't make you a football player. For that superb catch is nice but I would much rather that fall incomplete and he catch the routine ones that hit him
In the hands. I am not even going to mention his blocking skills. Fact is he is going to make the 53 because of potential and chance to see if the staff can turn him around. -
My concern with Egnew is he seems to lack athleticism. I may be way off with this but he appears to move very slow and deliberate. Does he look to you Guys as a TE that is going to beat linebackers? I see a possession type TE, not a guy who is a matchup problem for defenses.
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So after a career chock-full of catches in traffic, high catches, low catches, etc...two drops in preseason (one under extenuating circumstances) means he can't catch?
Even though he showed so stunningly on that 31 yard play that he actually has good hands?
Really?Pandarilla, CWBIII, DOLPHAN1 and 5 others like this. -
Mcduffie81, Mainge and Stringer Bell like this.
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He ran a 4.48 at the Combine. Don't particularly care what the "official" time was. I re-timed them all myself using HD video and made the starting point for the timer uniform across the board. He ran a 4.48, the same time that Mo Claiborne ran.
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Anonymous likes this.
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Egnew is a rookie going through growing pains.
He is SUPPOSED to be getting his *** chewed out and making mistakes, sure I wish he had more positive things to go on but I'm not calling this kid a bust. Not by a long shot. -
If in the final 2 preseason games Egnew plays at the same level or better, I bet you Hard Knocks will start pulling out all the positive praise about him and fans will start singing a different tune. Hard Knocks wants his story to be the guy who overcomes rookie struggles to shine.
Look at the Vontae Davis follow up beat from this week's episode. Hard Knocks has decided that Vontae has overcome his struggles, but they omitted the fact that he remains demoted.FinNasty likes this. -
If you're talking about Egnew and you say that phrase, it 100% implies you mean he can't catch. Maybe you didn't mean to imply it though.
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I don't think anyone should be calling Egnew a bust or thinking about cutting him, but I do think that when the coaching staff has an attitude about a guy where they seem to be just shaking their heads in disgust about him, there's probably something going on regarding the way the guy approaches the game.
It's okay if Egnew is having rookie developmental issues, but it's not okay if he's having issues that are a reflection of just not "getting it," whether that be due to intelligence or just lack of perseverance. And when I see the coaches seemingly shaking their heads in disgust about him, I get the sense that they believe he's just not getting it.
Now, I will say when he absolutely blasted that guy after he was chastised for not blocking, that was a good sign, so we'll see if he can turn this around over time.ToddPhin likes this. -
A side effect of HK is an already cynical fanbase now can literally cut 3rd rd picks before the season begins.
Chill out, he'll be fine..just keep playing him.His'nBeatYour'n likes this. -
If Dan Campbell is frustrated with him it's probably because Egnew is like the polar opposite of what Dan Campbell was as a TE. He probably wouldn't jive w/ Jermichael Finley, either. -
MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member
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ToddPhin likes this.
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MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member
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ckparrothead likes this.
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im a huge fan of egnew and i am not giving up on him, not every player drafted coming out of college is going to start out looking like a 5 year vet some need to be developed its the reason their are coaches.
let him develop and he will develop into a big time weapon IMOToddPhin and ckparrothead like this.
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