If you consider that he'd be replacing Hartline, and you consider the cap hit Hartline would've had, this is yet another masterful move in this offseason.

 

Well, if you're adding Kenny Stills and Michael Crabtree to a list that basically only had Jarvis Landry on it, I think it's pretty obvious that this team is going WR high in the draft.

But if we forget about the money for a second, the idea that losing Hartline could be a good thing was heavily based on getting a certain physical presence. We wanted someone bigger who could get YAC. Does Crabtree give us that? Eh, no, but it's not all bad. It's not that hard to replace 40 catches and 400 yards worth of production. That's peanuts.

This move would certainly make our draft day plans a bit more flexible which seems to be the goal. It doesn't erase WR from the list of needs but we'd be able to go WR in the 2nd or 3rd round which is (I think) a far more sensible idea than reaching for someone in the 1st round in order to pair him with a passer who probably isn't going to ever throw for Brees- or Stafford-esque yardage totals.

As I said before, I don't see a Sammy Watkins or Julio Jones in this WR class. I think there is depth but definitely no one I would reach for. More importantly, Tannehill isn't going to help any of these rookie WRs get 1200 yards. No matter who we bring in, their ceiling will be about 800 yards and 5 TDs in this offense with this QB, as we saw with Jarvis Landry last year. As I hinted above, they will be playing a position that produced about 450 yards for us last year. None of those numbers sounds like a 1st round WR to me. If we were going WR in the 1st round I'd like to be able to project that guy as someone who would be putting up well over 1,000 yards for us every season with 6 to 10 TDs as well.

As I said yesterday, I'm just not sure where the production is going to come from if we add a WR with pick #14. Would that help us? Yes, but is that the smartest move considering the depth in this WR class? Should we be looking to land a WR in the 2nd round maybe? That uncertainty makes me think that this team will be trying as hard as they can to stay open-minded when it comes to their 1st round selection. I think Tannenbaum and Hickey want to be able to move down depending on who's available and I think they want to be able to pick anyone who they think is a top-tier talent.

I think the team simply wants to go into the draft being able to go BPA throughout the higher picks and that seems like a great goal from where I sit because I could stand to see us go with a defensive player at any position just as much as I could see us going skill position or O-line.

 

The idea of losing Hartline being a good thing is that he sucked, regardless of money. He was horrible to average at everything important. He is a below average talent that benefitted from being on a team with even worse talent at WR than him (Bess & Nananee) then coverage issues thanks to Wallace. His averages are poor, his TDs are some of the worst historically in the league for #1/#2 WR. Then to top it all off, he was a dbag and cancer in the locker room. The only skill he possessed was sideline catches, to which I say, whoopie freaking doo.

 

Don't bad-mouth the Black Ninja by putting him in the same sentence as Legedonothing.

 

Oh, c'mon, you can't sit there and tell us all the guy "sucks." He did do enough to earn a pretty damn large contract. There was a reason we offered that to him in the first place. He was going to get paid somewhere. He had back to back 1,000-yd seasons with a super-raw (dare I say bad) QB and basically no talent around him besides Davone Bess? And because he was coming off an ACL injury, entering a new offense and got 50% the number of targets we were all expecting him to he sucks? You do realize he converted on the same percentage last year as in his two previous years, right? Anyone can see that when you get targeted at 50% the rate you did in prior years, your numbers are going to drop. Bill Lazor obviously wanted to give Tannehill a bunch of dump-off passes last year to move the chains which is why we saw Landry and Clay have solid seasons (2nd and 3rd leading receivers on the team, respectively) and why we saw Tannehill's completion percentage get so high even though as we all know he's not that great of a passer.

Eh, no offense but you sound like a typical fan. It's predictable talk from where I sit. Once a player has a down season or moves on, the fans turn their back on them and call them trash. I've seen it a thousand times and it's not news to me. I've been a fan of this team for the last 3 years just like you, so I'll remind you that you can't sit there and re-write history just because the guy is gone now or because he had a year under a new offensive coordinator that chose not to throw to him. Oh, and he talked about Ryan Tannehill in real terms. Ryan Tannehill threw for 4,000 yards last year and people peed their pants about it. Welcome to the modern NFL, that's to be expected guys. Tannehill isn't great. I like him but Hartline's words were always accurate.

All of Jarvis Landry's production last year? About three-quarters of those passes used to go to Hartline. So if you are patting Landry on the back you'd better realize that production is the same no matter the number or name on the jersey. If you want to say Hartline sucks, you might as well well say the same thing for Landry who padded his stats with all the targets that used to go to Hartline. Landry is a good slot guy. Hartline was a good outside guy. There's little difference. Hartline is never going to get YAC. Landry is never going to operate outside the numbers. If you hate Hartline now, give Jarvis Landry about 3 years and you'll be claiming his lack of size and speed are liabilities, too.

 

From the comments a 49er fan....makes me feel good:

 

1000 yrd season means nothing. Its a pointless benchmark on its own that people assign to a receiver. I was down on Hartline since his first 1000 yrd season. You can search to find it or don't, I don't much care. But that year he was the worst #1 Wr on any team in meaningful stats.

1000 yrd seasons only matter if there's other good stats to go with it like TDs, or a good YPC/YPT. There aren't with him. He's crap.

Now really, if you want to question someone's opinion being clouded by fandom, then I would think anyone who valued Hartline is probably being a homer.

Also, where did I mention Landry? I didn't.

But since you brought him up, he has better hands, was a rookie, a leader and is cheaper than Hartline. He also plays the slot. If you think the #2 WR on a team should have similar numbers as a slot WR than you probably aren't qualified to make the argument you're making.

 

Exactly its like hitting .300 with no RBIs or homeruns.....great, you hit a bunch of singles. But you didnt help your team win games.

 

Don't be jelly

 

That chick let him do that, because he's so buck toothed he can open her wine bottle with his mouth.

 

Nice, it's one of the Top 5 answers, but number 1 was: "Because they both live in Ohio"

 

Landry has better hands the Hartline? Really? First of all, where are all these amazing catches Jarvis Landry is making because I don't see them. Catching passes out of the slot ain't very hard. If a 2nd round rookie can come in and catch 85 balls I'm pretty sure it's ain't rocket science because Jarvis Landry is a great kid but he's not exactly a Hall of Famer. I'm not sure what "better hands" means to you but maybe you should go back and watch Hartline's 2012 and 2013 seasons. There are numerous catches in there that Landry just can't make as a smaller, slot WR.

I'm sorry I have to call you out for being down on Hartline's 2012 and 2013 seasons but a person can't say what you're saying and still be credible. I'm inviting you to go back and inform yourself because you clearly have formed an opinion of Hartline that is based on his 2014 season alone.

I'll take Hartline's 2012 and 2013 hands on my team any day of the week. He was damn good. He didn't make all those catches last year because the new offense changed what routes he was running and because he got 50% of the targets he had been getting. This isn't opinion or made up stuff. These are facts.

 

Funny thing is when he went to have sex with her, he tripped before entering and ruined the mood....

 

So you judge catch ability by the always trusty "amazing catches" category you just made up and has no set of parameters? Awesome. Thanks for that.

You're on the internet, use it. Go out and see how good Landry's hands are. Bring us numbers. Then we'll talk.

 

Also a Top 5 answer, but #1 was "They tried to make it work, but soon after realizing there would be contact, he immediately collapsed into the fetal position".

 

$3.5M for Crabtree is a very good deal. If it's multiple years with low guarantee, it's even better. Very low risk and potential high reward when you consider scheme fit, and if he returns to pre-injury form.

 

You guys don't have the bottom part of that picture, I do. The bottom part shows the woman sitting on a stool, with her hairy back exposed, and that poor bastard shaving her back with hair clippers. You can see the disgust in his face.

 

Exactly we need to A) wait until its finalized and B) wait to see the incentives and guarantees on the contract.

If we're the only ones sniffing on this guy, we can go low risk high reward....its a win-win for everyone.

 

Before the picture was taken:

"OMG Becca, take a funny picture with that human beaver dressed in a 90's prom outfit!!!"

 

Yeah, I needed his teeth to plow the fields and he declined.

 

That's Cameron.

Ironic you should say that, because Cooper and White are virtual Watkins and Jones clones, respectively, and they'll likely be picked at about the same spots in the first round.

 

I agree with what you said about Hartline, but the cap hit he would've had in 2015 was way out of proportion with the role he would've had.

What we're seeing here is someone who's entered the front office who has a great deal of skill in getting the biggest bang for the buck out of players.

 

1k wr yards is 62 yards a game.... that's not much lol.... at least wallace got us 10 TD's a better number to judge wr's by. What's the use of all the yards if you can't score.

 

I like this move. We needed some depth at WR and OL and got it with out last two signings pretty cheap. Neither one is a game changer but gives is depth, flexibility in the draft and now we can focus on finding 2-4 starters out of the draft.

I wouldnt be be upset if we traded back 5-15 spots and picked up a 2nd/3rd rounder.

 

You guys got to stop believing everything you read on the internet.

I mean really an article from one of those sites that lets anyone with a pulse write something based on a misheard twitter post.

Unless it comes from a reputable source....don't headline a thread with it.

 

So RT has peaked then. Consistently improved since being here...but he's done with all that improvement stuff.

Got ya.

 

I see White and Cooper as elite prospects and wouldn't take them off my board unless I had two young all-pro WRs on board. But I would probably not be seriously looking at any other WR in the first if we signed Crabtree to go along with what we have.

 

Well, I'll preface with "I certainly could be wrong", but I don't believe that adding Crabtree indicates we are going high in the draft for a WR.

1) there are other glaring needs...S, CB, LB, TE, OG, RB.
2) TBaum has stated that he wanted to equal out the resources between O and D... both financially and talent wise.
3) Crabtree added to Landry, Matthews, Cameron, Sims, Stills and any UDFA gives us a mediocre group, but one that matches well with the O that Lazor preaches, as well as Thill's strengths...
4) I'm still not sure where the lines are between Phibo, Hickey and Tbaum...we know that Tbaum is the boss but I just don't know that the other guys have as much influence as they had, say last offseason... If that's the case, unless one of the top WRs happen to fall into our laps and at the same time a trade down can't be made, then Tbaum might jump that way. But that's the only way I see it happening...
5) we can improve in EVERY position except perhaps at one DT spot with the talent we have. I don't know that he'd pass up a guy that improves this team at ANY position just because of perceived 'need'. That's not Tbaum's MO...

This is going to be an interesting draft for us but I think Tbaum is building for the next couple of seasons, not just for next season...

 

I still want a WR at 14.

 

Not a huge fan of this move but I'm guessing they feel we have too many holes to fill, so they rather sign this stopgap versus drafting a wr.

 

I think that point #5 will help answer point #4 once we see how the draft turns out. Tannenbaum drafts BPA to a greater degree than most. That is, he has a history of drafting what he thinks might be an impact player at a position of relative strength. Hickey didn't do that last year. Also, Hickey and Philbin like high-character guys (all those team captains, etc..), while Tannenbaum never seemed to place too much emphasis on that.

I think the draft will give us some useful information on what the power relationships among the three are.

 

By that logic, what "benchmark" in sport isn't pointless? I mean, this discussion is pointless. This forum is pointless. Football is pointless. Maybe even life itself is pointless.

Hartline accomplished something that is very rare, even in this day and age of the prolific passing game. When it gets down to it Hartline was an average receiver, and we dumped him the second he became below average. But it was Ireland that ****ed up big time by not extending Hartline before he became a free agent and we overpaid for him. Like we, and every team overpays for every free agent. What should have have done was extended Hartline 3 years at about $4 mill per year, which was more in line with his value. Then if he progressed we could extend him again and if he faltered we could cut him free of charge.

And the irony is for me Ryan Tannehill is the Brian Hartline of QBs. He could still go either way but whats highly likely is he'll remain average.

 

really? something that 20-30 other people do a year is rare?

 

Oh stop it.

First of all, you clearly didn't read anything else I said, because I explain it more.

Secondly, 1000 yrds on there own is pointless not from an existential standpoint but from a it doesn't matter in football standpoint. 1000 yrds receiving proves nothing without having other good stats to go with it. Its like saying that since the paint job on that Yugo is nice, its a good car.

 

It's not that all benchmarks are meaningless, but rather just the 1,000 yard season is meaningless all by itself. As others have pointed out, you only need to average 63 yards per game, which is not a lot. At this point a 1,000 yard season is more about staying healthy than being good.

Just consider that Hartline caught all those passes and got all those yards and yet he was still allergic to the endzone. It's the equivalent of Kobe Bryant shooting 50 times a game to score 50 points, when Steph Curry can score 50 by only shooting 20 times. For all those yards Hartline produced, he rarely ever put points on the board and he rarely ever improved our chances of winning the game. So by that measure alone, the 1,000 yard season is meaningless by itself because its not a helpful statistic in judging performance.

 

The main problem I would have with signing Crabtree is he has the same Diva personality that Wallace had. Of course the cost to sign Crabtree would be far less than it was to sign Wallace, so it might be worth the risk.

I just wonder if Philbin is in favor of signing another diva WR or this is all the doing of Tannebaum, if it actually happens.

The one area you need to check your facts is in YAC for Crabtree. The fact is that he had over 260 in YAC yardage last year and that was better than any WR on the Dolphins roster except Landry.

He might not be the big and fast WR everyone seems to want, but he is a proven NFL player and would certainly be an upgrade over Hartline and Gibson.

 

Show me a list of the last 20-30 people to have back to back 1000 yard seasons, I'll bet you a nickel Hartline is the only "sucky" receiver on that list.