Not even close...

 

I love posts like this. No real substance. Nothing measurable or provable.

Just fairytales and myths.

 

It's clearly measurable. I just didn't go into details. The "it" factor, "clutch" et al, are not.

You lose. As usual... ;)

 

I'd take Peyton over Brady, but its very close.

 

You are mistaken in your definition of the word, "clearly."

Plus I am saddened by your desire to "win" on a message board.

 

The argument against him being the GOAT isn't great but it's there. Without a doubt, he's top 5 all-time. What I wouldn't give to be in the Patriots position.

 

Too often people like to use TEAM accomplishments to prove individual greatness.

Just look at the individual.

 

nothing sacrilegious about calling Brady GOAT, he's certainly in the discussion

 

So would nearly all of the 20 living HoF QB's.

20 were asked who they would choose. 4 decided not to choose. 13 1/2 chose Manning. 2 1/2 chose Brady. ( 1/2 was from Montana. He chose Brady for the 1st half and Manning for the 2nd half)

 

Looking at the individual his ability to mid season go from a vertical based offense to a spread based offense has been amazing.

If the best quarterback of all time was something that was actually measurable, at this point, his name will have to come up in the debate. Not only that, it wouldn't be that hard to debate him as the best.

 

Would you put Bob Griese in the GOAT discussion?

 

Not really. With Moss all Brady had to do was dump it off to Welker a few times to suck in the DB's and then heave a jump ball to Moss and watch him go and get it. Brady has never been a great vertical QB without Moss. He's went back to his short, safe, high percentage, run-via-the-short pass, game. Nothing new for Brady.

 

there scheme is a VERY friendly scheme when it comes to ints. he rarely has to force it because they run multiple WR sets and quick slants/routes.

 

:lol:

Well played. This thread is going to be a joy to read.

 

Wrong. I don't know why people think this. It must be true that if you say it enough times, most people will just believe it even when lacking proof. Brady has not done more with less. He's done more with more. Hence the reason you can't judge individuals using Super Bowl wins. If that were the case Dilfer is better than Marino. Bradshaw is better than Steve Young. And Griese is the best QB ever because he won 2 Super Bowls and played for a team that had an undefeated season.

But don't just take my word for it:

Fran Tarkenton, the man whose milestones for career touchdowns and passing yards Manning recently surpassed. “I love them both, but if you put a gun to my head and said which one do you choose, I'd say Peyton. Peyton has not had the players around him that Brady has had, but Peyton is a coach on and off the field.

Nope. Team accomplishments are not the things to look at when looking at individual greatness.

 

It may have been well played if he realized what he was saying. When you quote someone, verbatim, while trying to demean them with that quote a person should really make sure they comprehend the quote or at least the context. Dupree did neither. Thus he failed.

 

I bleed aqua and orange and will never acknowledge anyone is better than Marino was, but I have to admit...Brady is pretty damn good! Any top 5 all-time list without him in it would be ridiculous.

 

Your nonsensical arguements designed to somehow diminish what Brady has been able to accomplish during his illustrious career are both well-documented and comical.

 

Joe Montana
Johnny U.
Dan Marino
Otto Graham
John Elway
Fran Tarkenton
Steve Young
Brett Favre
Dan Fouts
Roger Staubach

Here is a top 10 list, no particular order. Now, when Manning retires he will push someone off. When Brady retires, who will he push off? And if he does, how does he make the top 5?

 

And yet I still can't get someone to comment on their "it" or "clutch" methods of proving greatness. LMAO!!

Talk about comical.

 

I hate Tommy Brady, but I must admit, he's a top 3 QB of all time.

I'm sorry. He gets it done. I've rooted against him now for almost 10 years. He's so damn good its silly.

 

Look at that top 10 list I made. Pick the best three and then throw one of them out and replace him with Brady.

Who are your top 3 and who do you then throw off to fit Brady in?

 

Wow That was by far the most INACCURATE thing ever stated in football!!! Lets look at facts:

WR -- P Manning has the advantage with Harrison,Wayne, Clark for his entire career. Brady has had Branch, Moss and Welker (3 best WR) can anyone with a straight face say he had BETTER WR?

O Line -- When Healthy its a PUSH...

Coaching -manning has had just ONE O Coordinator his entire career, I think Brady is on #3? (Weis,McDanels, O'Brian) And yes changing O coordiantors makes a difference.

Manning has had the advantage with his Offense, the difference is Brady has always had a good Defense, where Manning has not.

 

you write that as if it is easy.

 

Joe Montana - Brady is better
Johnny U. -Never saw him play, other than in highlights
Dan Marino - Brady is equal (sorry)
Otto Graham - Never saw him play, other than in highlights
John Elway - Brady is better. Clearly, in my opinion.
Fran Tarkenton - Never saw him play, other than in highlights
Steve Young - Brady is better. Clearly, in my opinion
Brett Favre - Brady is better. Clearly, in my opinion
Dan Fouts - Brady is better. Clearly, in my opinion
Roger Staubach - Brady is better. Clearly, in my opinion

I'd go (alphabetically)
Brady
Marino
Unitas (never saw him play, but from what I understand, he was amazing)

 

going off the QBs I have actually seen play on that list:

Joe Montana is the most similar to brady great player and makes everyone on his team better.

Johnny U. never saw him play.

Dan Marino most like Peyton, great passer. Personally if I remove my miami dolphin blinders and my hate of the patriots. I believe Brady is a better overall QB, not a better passer.

Otto Graham never saw

John Elway, like brady better.

Fran Tarkenton, in an era where passing was just starting out. like brady better.

Steve Young a dual threat, but how much was him vs his supporting cast. Would take brady.

Brett Favre, brady better in big games.

Dan Fouts, great passer but Marino and Peyton are better

Roger Staubach, wasn't asked to carry the team as much as brady. I don't believe any QB during that era did.


So I think an argument can be made. but these are opinions there will be no right or wrong answer.
It's like do you like apples or oranges.

PS how much would you have liked it to have brady and bellicheck here over the last 10 years than in New England and then answer the questions. I would kill for them to have been Miami dolphins. they are IMO what we are not, smart.

 

I think brady is better than fouts,farve,staubach,tarkenton,young and i would even take him over elway.I cannot comment on players I have never seen play like johhnuy u,graham,
I love marino and I will never put anybody above him,but every expert on this planet will have brady a top 5 qb when he is done playing no doubt about it.

 

Joe Montana -- The Best ever and MOST clutch performer in NFL History
Johnny U. --- Great.
Dan Marino -- Great (PIA but I am a Pats fan lol)
Otto Graham -- Falls off when Mannin retires.
John Elway -- in at #9
Fran Tarkenton -- lol really? Not even in my top 15 all time!
Steve Young - Great
Brett Favre -- MOST OVER RATED QB in history and a perfect example of STATS not meaning squat!
Dan Fouts __ Great
Roger Staubach - great...

Now when Brady and Manning retire (In no order as I dont want a peeing contest)...

1. Montana
2. Brady
3.Manning
4. Marino
5. Johnny U.
6. Young
7. Staubach
8. Fouts
9. Elway
10. Bradshaw

Your top 10 all off stats.. and as a great HC says "stats are for losers" ok BB says that but I think he is a great HC

 

Writing it was easy.

If you were talking about what Brady has done, well, it's not like it's that hard. Brady is a smart guy, I'm not saying that. Brady wants to win. Brady studies and from what I can tell, practices hard. However, Brady has nowhere near the talent of any of the All-Time greats. Add to it that he has played on some of the greatest TEAMS ever and you get people wanting to crown him as GOAT.

Well, the same thing happened to Bradshaw when he played. The same thing happened to Griese when he played. There are numerous QB's who benefitted from playing on GREAT teams and thus, at the time, were the media darlings and some of the lemming fans fell for it.

Brady is a HoF QB, no doubt, but then again so is Joe Namath. Now, I think Brady is better than Namath, but I would never put Brady in the top 10 of greatest QB's of all time.

 

If you're going only by stats your top 10 doesn't make sense. I don't think you bothered to look at the stats. If you had, your list would be different.

 

How is the team he is currently playing on nearly one of the best ever?

 

Dol-fan,

Great point, this CURRENT team has STATISTICALLY (MariNEpHIN LIKES STATS) one of the worst D in the league. (I think ranked 29th or 30th?) Brady is also doing his run with these receivers (Branch,Tate, Welker, and 2 rookie TE) also he has an UNDRAFTED RB and Ben Jarvis Green Ellis and a cast off from the Jets in Woodhead.

 

are you really trying to argue your point by quoting someone that really says Peyton has not had the players around him Brady has??!?

 

Brady. Brady is an assassin in big games. He is arguably the most ice in his veins mother****er ever.

Hate with begrudging respect.

 

I'm not going solely on stats. If we all relied solely on stats, then everybody's lists would be the same!!!

 

"Has played" infers present tense to you?