I really think this is the draft to walk out with two first round talents..

Just do it..you'll still have both thirds I believe.

 

Lane Johnson, Menelick Watson, Jon Martin.. that's still two rookies and a below average second year tackle protecting the franchise player. I just can't see them bookending the line with a rookie and a rookie, or a rook and a second year. Albert makes sense, Winston makes sense.

 

That's too much youth. To me the ideal scenario is to convince K.C. that you are going to trade up and instead send them the late second rounder for Brandon Albert once you've established the negotiating position you need. Once that's done you move on and trade down to the end of the first round with absolutely no pressing needs. You can simply pick talent for seven straight picks regardless of team need.

 

But no matter how you look at it, I think we need two OTs because we can't trust Martin at either spot unless he pleasantly surprises in training camp.


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Then you draft a Ricky Wagner at some point in the middle rounds.

1- Tank Carradine
2- Jamar Taylor
2- Giovani Bernard
3- Stedman Bailey
3- Travis Kelce
4- Kiko Alonso

In addition to Brandon Albert. Now that's the type of draft I can get behind.

 

Agreed. Though I doubt we find a trade partner late in the first.

I think Star falls to 12 and the Cowboys swap with us to nab Star to wear the star.

At 18 you can justify Chance Warmack, Jon Cooper, Xavier Rhodes, Tyler Eifert perhaps (though less likely).

We may have to send them our 4th also if we want their 2nd not their 3rd.



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Martin just needs to get stronger. I'm guessing he knows that.

 

I dont understand all the buzz around Cooper @ 12. I like him BUT a. that is high for a OG and b. We just signed Louis so I doubt the Fins are going to spend a 1st round pick for an OG… I could see it later in the draft but not at 12.

 

there fixed it for you

 

I'm guessing he knew that about making the leap to the pro's too, but word is that he is not a guy who works out hard regardless.

Don't expect him to change his stripes suddenly.



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It's not uncommon to see players make big strength gains after their rookie year. And we already have seen that picture of him pulling the truck as part of his workout. I'm guessing that was a change from what he used to do.

 

LOTS of talk about Star here in Dallas. I won't say he's being talked about as much as Mo Claiborne was this time last year....but yeah, actually I would say that... :shifty:

Star in Dallas actually makes TONS of sense. Dline is a dire need for them. They resigned Ratliff even though he was INCREDIBLY stupid a few months ago. The fact that he lost one team-mate due to Aggravated Man-slaughter via DWI, and another due to..well DEATH because of a result of said DWI amazes me he would be stupid enough to drive after getting blitzed. All this has them amazingly thin at D-line...of course, they are also paper-thin at O-line so who knows (They gave us a 7th round pick for Ryan freakin Cook last off-season, and he was actually an upgrade and immediate starter for them. Who says Romo isn't earning that contract?)

 

IF we are all in on going O-line first round, I think they only way the go after Cooper is if Lane Johnson is off the board, and then they trade back several spots. Otherwise, I think there is about zero chance we go Cooper at 12. JMHO

 

Exactly. Remember how Pouncy was driven back quite often his rookie season? Pretty decent turn around his second season.

 

Sure, but Pouncey at least showed promise his Rookie season. Martin looked really bad last season. Really bad.

I think Martin will turn around, but I don't expect it to be real soon. Do you trust him protecting Tannehill's blindside? I don't. Not yet.

 

Do I trust him? Not yet, but not ready to hit the panic button on him either. It comes down to if Ireland and Philbin feel comfortable that he will progress or not.

Being flipped flopped around didn't help his case either imo.

 

I still think he is going to be a quality player, and I agree, he walked into an entirely different world, then was flipped from the Left (College) to the Right and then back again.

I also think he won't have much trouble putting some bulk on. That is the least of these guys troubles. I think that towards the latter part of this season, and perhaps not until this time next year, he will:

A) Understand his assignments and the ZBS much better
B) Have another 20-30 LBS of muscle.


That being said, we have nobody to man whichever Tackle position he doesn't anchor. That is still a problem. I flip flop myself on where he should play, and whether or not just bringing in a new RT via FA is the way to go. Just hate to see Tannehill take too many more hits from his blindside. That can absolutely ruin a QB.

 

He won't improve sitting on the bench though. Duane Brown improved a little in his 2nd season, to the middle of the pack, but didn't take the big leap to the top 10 among tackles till his 3rd season. Somehow the Texans QB survived Brown's first two seasons of pass blocking, which were not a whole lot better than Martin. IMO, cries that Martin will get Tannehill killed are a little overblown. They may need to give Martin a little help sometimes, or throw more quick passes. Martin needs reps if he is gonna get better.

 

Tannehill was sacked 36 freakin times last year. It is only going to get worse.

Let's not forget that the Texans offense is a Run first, then pass action off of that. Completely different. Not even close to what our offensive line is going to be doing. The ONLY similarity is the ZBS. Nothing else.

Oh yeah, lets also not forget that Schaub is not a Sophmore...and he almost did get killed on several occasions himself.

It's a tough problem. I trust in what they do with Martin, but we still have a gaping hole at the Tackle spot opposite wherever he lines up...and no, I don't agree with the argument that he was better at LT than RT. Some numbers say so, but watching him doesn't.

 

You don't know that to be true. None of us knows how much or if Martin improves in 2013. We also don't know yet whom our 5 starters are going to be. If Louis starts at RG, that is a pass blocking upgrade from Jerry.
Tannehill is also more athletic than Schaub, and our offense last season was a run first offense too, such as it was.
Brown's sacks improved from 11 as a rookie to 7, to 5, then 4, 0 and 4. I'm going to take a guess that Martin improves to some degree.

Martin did not do better at LT, I agree. In fact his sacks, hit and hurries allowed were more the last 8 games than in the first 8. Philbin is an OL guru and so is Sherman, not to mention Jim Turner. I guess we need to trust they'll address the situation properly, rather than gnashing our teeth and wailing lamentations about it. Not saying you specifically are doing that. Just the tone in general. I think Ireland will address the OL personnel wise as close as he can to Philbin's wishes.

 

I don't think the effect of having more than 2 (merely) competent targets on a given play can be overstated.

 

In 2011, Texas A&M's offense that Sherman coached and Tannehill run was pretty close to 50/50 run/pass. I think they ran 48.6% of the time, and passed 51.4%. Last year, Miami ran it 46.6% and passed it 53.4%. As a comparison, last year, Houston Texans ran the ball 47.8% and threw it 52.2%. Back in 2010, they ran it 42.4% and passed 57.6%. I don't think Sherman's offense is that out of line from a run/pass ratio from what Houston does and/or has done.

Tannehill is more mobile than Schaub, and over the off-season, word was that Miami might be letting Tannehill be more mobile, putting in some pistol formations. Martin was a rookie last year and didn't play well, but I think his chances of being much better this year are decent. I do think we'll address the line in some way or ways thru the draft and maybe even with what's left in free agency. I certainly don't think it's a foregone conclusion that sack totals are going to be worse. I anticipate that with Tannehill having a year in, he's going to at least be somewhat better and more decisive reading defenses pre-snap count and as plays develop, and I think the line will be at least as efficient as last year. All in all, no worse and probably better.

 

There's some serious guns being jumped on Martin here. Sheesh. He's had one damn season. Seriously.

 

Fluker would make more sense than any 1st round corner. I want Austin but I don't think we can go wrong with a top tier right tackle who can smother guys in the run game.

With the quality draft depth at CB, DT, G, S, and pass rushers, Fluker makes as much sense as Pouncey did in 2011 IMO.

 

I think your ideal situation does not move Martin back to RT, and does not bet the farm on him at LT.

Ideally, you get a vet RT and draft an OT to compete with Martin at LT (Watson, Nixon, Fragel?)

 

Btw, Reid Fragel, for his movility and versatility is not getting nearly enough highlighting as a potential Dolphins.

 

None of that changes the fact that Duane Brown gave up 49 total pressures in 482 pass snaps in his rookie season, 53 in 620 pass snaps during his second year, and improved to 30 pressures in 473 pass snaps by his third season, 26 in 487 in his 4th season, and 22 in 579 pass snaps in 2012.

 

Unless something surprising happens with Eric Winston, I think it is pretty obvious that Miami will not add a veteran right tackle. They are likely going to do one of two things. They are either going to move up for Joeckel or Johnson to play left tackle and keep Jonathan Martin at right tackle, or they are going to get an athletic right tackle prospect such as Menelik Watson that could possibly move to the left side down the road and continue to develop Martin at left tackle.

 

I don't see how Fluker makes any sense at all for a team that runs a zone blocking scheme.

 

I hope Fluker is not the pick, not only due to scheme but due to talent available at 12 making him a reach with great opportunity cost.


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Please say no to Fluker at #12. Watson's not worth the #12 pick due to his inexperience, but I'd rather take him there if it meant not picking Fluker.